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[00:00:01.440 --> 00:00:05.440] Ever whispered, maybe I could create an online course someday?
[00:00:05.440 --> 00:00:10.240] And then you thought, nope, too overwhelming, too risky, and way too much tech.
[00:00:10.240 --> 00:00:11.840] That's you, I get it.
[00:00:11.840 --> 00:00:18.160] When I started, I had no clue where to begin, no extra hours, and no idea if anyone would buy.
[00:00:18.160 --> 00:00:20.400] Then I met Amy Porterfield.
[00:00:20.400 --> 00:00:27.120] She gave me a clear, doable path, and that someday dream became a profitable, sustainable part of my business.
[00:00:27.120 --> 00:00:31.600] Now I've built multiple online courses that earn while I live my life.
[00:00:31.600 --> 00:00:37.680] That's why I'm so excited to tell you about Course Confident, a live boot camp with Amy herself.
[00:00:37.680 --> 00:00:40.560] Four live trainings with one clear outcome.
[00:00:40.560 --> 00:00:49.360] Nail your profitable course topic, choose your type and price with confidence, and learn how to attract your future students without being glued to your screen.
[00:00:49.360 --> 00:00:52.240] You'll be in a private-driven community that gets it.
[00:00:52.240 --> 00:01:02.000] The doubts, the wins, the why is this so hard moments, the accountability, ideas, and encouragement you need to move from thinking about it to doing it.
[00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:05.360] Join through jennakutcher.com forward slash bootcamp.
[00:01:05.360 --> 00:01:15.120] And when you join, you'll also get my beginner-friendly mini course, The Pinterest Kickstart, which is your quick start guide to growing your audience and email list before you even launch.
[00:01:15.120 --> 00:01:17.920] $27 of value, yours free.
[00:01:17.920 --> 00:01:24.960] If you want more freedom, more alignment, and income you don't have to chase daily, this is your next right step.
[00:01:24.960 --> 00:01:26.720] We start September 11th.
[00:01:26.720 --> 00:01:31.600] Save your spot today at jennakutcher.com forward slash bootcamp.
[00:01:35.440 --> 00:01:38.960] Huge savings on Dell AI PCs are here.
[00:01:38.960 --> 00:01:40.400] And it's a big deal.
[00:01:40.400 --> 00:01:41.120] Why?
[00:01:41.120 --> 00:01:48.080] Because Dell AI PCs with Intel Core ultra-processors are newly designed to help you do more faster.
[00:01:48.080 --> 00:01:50.880] It's pretty amazing what they can do in a day's work.
[00:01:50.880 --> 00:01:58.720] They can generate code, edit images, multitask without leg, draft emails, summarize documents, create live translations.
[00:01:58.720 --> 00:02:03.480] They can even extend your battery life so you never have to worry about forgetting your charger.
[00:02:03.480 --> 00:02:11.560] It's like having a personal assistant built right into your PC to cover the menial tasks so that you can focus on what matters.
[00:02:11.560 --> 00:02:15.000] That's the power of Dell AI with Intel Inside.
[00:02:15.000 --> 00:02:25.560] With deals on Dell AI PCs like the Dell 16 Plus starting at $749.99, it is the perfect time to refresh your tech and take back your time.
[00:02:25.560 --> 00:02:30.600] Upgrade your AI PC today by visiting dell.com/slash deals.
[00:02:30.600 --> 00:02:33.720] That's dell.com/slash deals.
[00:02:38.520 --> 00:02:40.680] Your website isn't a nice to have.
[00:02:40.680 --> 00:02:43.240] It's one of your most powerful business tools.
[00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:53.400] In this conversation with Jen Olmsted, we reveal how to turn your website into an investment that pays you back, attracting the right people, making you money, and finally feeling like you.
[00:02:54.360 --> 00:02:57.960] I'm Jenna Kutcher, your host of the Goldigger podcast.
[00:02:57.960 --> 00:03:04.760] I escaped the corporate world at the age of 23 with nothing more than a $300 camera from Craigslist and a dream.
[00:03:04.760 --> 00:03:12.920] Now I'm running a seven-figure online business that feels even better than it looks all from my house in small town, Minnesota with my family.
[00:03:12.920 --> 00:03:15.880] Here, we value time as our currency.
[00:03:15.880 --> 00:03:23.240] We mix the woo and the work, and we are in the pursuit of building businesses that give us the freedom to live lives that we love.
[00:03:23.240 --> 00:03:28.520] I've always loved turning big goals into reality, and I'm here to help you do the same.
[00:03:28.520 --> 00:03:30.760] This isn't just a peek behind the curtain.
[00:03:30.760 --> 00:03:34.440] Come along with me and my guests as we tear the whole curtain down.
[00:03:34.440 --> 00:03:41.880] Every week, we tackle practical, no-fluff marketing strategies and host honest discussions on what works and what doesn't.
[00:03:41.880 --> 00:03:47.840] Join me and my expert guests for actionable insights to help you grow your dream business with confidence.
[00:03:44.840 --> 00:03:52.000] Pull up a seat and get ready to be challenged, inspired, and empowered.
[00:03:52.320 --> 00:03:55.280] This is the Gold Digger podcast.
[00:03:56.240 --> 00:03:59.600] Have you ever whispered to yourself, I really need a website?
[00:03:59.600 --> 00:04:03.200] And then you immediately close a tab and told yourself you're not ready yet.
[00:04:03.200 --> 00:04:06.640] Or maybe you have a website, but it's kind of a mess.
[00:04:06.640 --> 00:04:08.160] You're embarrassed to send people there.
[00:04:08.160 --> 00:04:09.920] It doesn't reflect your business anymore.
[00:04:09.920 --> 00:04:13.120] And honestly, you don't even know if it's doing anything.
[00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:28.880] In a world of endless funnels, pop-ups, email sequences, and social media strategies, it is easy to forget that your website, a beautiful, simple, strategic home on the internet, can still be your most powerful business tool if it's done right.
[00:04:28.880 --> 00:04:32.240] And that's what today's guest is here to unpack.
[00:04:32.240 --> 00:04:43.840] Jen Omsted is a brand and web designer, a visual storyteller, and a certified type nerd who has made it her mission to create online spaces that people actually want to explore.
[00:04:43.840 --> 00:04:52.240] She's also the co-founder of Tonic Sight Shop, home of the most stunning cocktail-inspired website templates for modern stylish creatives.
[00:04:52.240 --> 00:04:57.360] She's also a very, very dear friend of mine and no stranger to the Gold Digger podcast.
[00:04:57.360 --> 00:05:03.760] Jen was actually the very first guest ever on this show way back in episode number two.
[00:05:03.760 --> 00:05:09.200] And she came back again in 2020 to share some questions you should ask before designing your website.
[00:05:09.200 --> 00:05:24.880] Now, what I love about Jen's work is how it combines aesthetics and strategy in a way that helps you build a website that actually works for you, meaning it's attracting the right people and telling your story clearly and converting visitors into paying clients or customers.
[00:05:24.880 --> 00:05:34.600] That can be done while you are living your life and stepping away from your screen and finally stopping to feel like you have to be on all the time.
[00:05:34.760 --> 00:05:37.800] Your website can be working while you rest.
[00:05:37.800 --> 00:05:46.360] So, whether you have been duct taping your site together or you don't even have a website at all yet, trust me, this episode is for you.
[00:05:46.360 --> 00:05:57.560] And if you are ready to give your website a major glow up after this conversation, you can chop tonic templates at jennakutcher.com forward slash tonic and use the code Jenna sent me.
[00:05:57.560 --> 00:05:59.640] It's Jenna sent me all one word.
[00:05:59.640 --> 00:06:05.240] Head to jennakutcher.com forward slash tonic because you deserve a website that works while you rest.
[00:06:05.240 --> 00:06:11.560] And let me tell you, this episode is going to leave you so fired up and so excited to work on your site.
[00:06:11.560 --> 00:06:13.080] All right, let's get into it.
[00:06:13.080 --> 00:06:17.160] Jen Ohm said, Welcome back to the Gold Digger podcast.
[00:06:17.480 --> 00:06:20.600] Okay, here's a big question that I want to start off with.
[00:06:20.600 --> 00:06:30.360] So here's my question: What if the reason your business feels stuck isn't because you're doing too little, but because your website isn't doing enough?
[00:06:30.680 --> 00:06:33.400] Yeah, it's a tale as old as time.
[00:06:33.400 --> 00:06:46.680] And the mental picture that always comes to me is like seeing this girl in a cute matching Lulu workout set on the treadmill at the gym, and she's just like sweating, working so hard, but the treadmill is not actually plugged in.
[00:06:47.000 --> 00:07:01.160] And it's, I think it's like that when your website isn't really working for you because you are like hustling, you're posting on Instagram, networking, sending emails, doing all the things, but you're still not moving forward because the place you're sending the traffic isn't actually converting for you.
[00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:13.240] And so it's one of those things where, like, you can be working so hard doing so many things right, but if your website isn't working, it's like you have this star salesman that is sitting under the desk eating snacks and like doom strolling.
[00:07:13.240 --> 00:07:21.360] And I just feel like most people don't realize that your website should be this part of your business that works harder than you do.
[00:07:21.680 --> 00:07:22.640] It could be great.
[00:07:22.640 --> 00:07:24.000] Like it doesn't get tired.
[00:07:24.000 --> 00:07:25.200] It doesn't need a break.
[00:07:25.200 --> 00:07:27.200] It doesn't need to like scroll Netflix.
[00:07:27.200 --> 00:07:29.840] It can be out there fielding every lead.
[00:07:29.840 --> 00:07:33.120] It can be convincing people that you're the best option.
[00:07:33.120 --> 00:07:39.840] And so a lot of times I think we don't think we're working hard enough, but really it's just our website that's not doing its job.
[00:07:39.840 --> 00:07:45.840] It's like this beautiful storefront, but there's like a coming soon sign or the front door is locked.
[00:07:45.840 --> 00:07:55.120] And so I think if you're like feeling stuck in your business, it's really worth asking, like, is it me or is my website just quietly sabotaging all of my hard work?
[00:07:55.120 --> 00:08:04.080] Because when you fix that, all the effort that you're putting in on the treadmill suddenly results in this forward momentum and an actual sales for your business.
[00:08:04.800 --> 00:08:05.120] Okay.
[00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:20.880] I am obsessed and I'm obsessed with that metaphor because I think you just hit the nail on the head for so many people listening where they're like, I am literally doing all the things and it is not resulting in results.
[00:08:20.880 --> 00:08:28.880] And that feeling is probably the most empty, lonely, frustrating feeling of entrepreneurship.
[00:08:28.880 --> 00:08:34.400] And I feel like our tendencies are to turn towards the really shiny things like social media.
[00:08:34.400 --> 00:08:38.080] Like, if only I go viral, then this will solve the problem.
[00:08:38.080 --> 00:08:39.760] And I don't know about you, but I've gone viral.
[00:08:39.760 --> 00:08:42.480] It did nothing for my business.
[00:08:42.480 --> 00:08:48.320] And so I love this idea of like our website should be working for us and not the other way around.
[00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:49.920] So, here's my question.
[00:08:49.920 --> 00:09:07.400] So, most entrepreneurs, and you and I have like witnessed this in the flesh, they're either embarrassed about their website, they feel behind when it comes to their website, or it's like one of those lingering things on there to do of like, I should probably get one or I should probably like update it.
[00:09:07.720 --> 00:09:10.120] So, what would you say to the person who's listening?
[00:09:10.120 --> 00:09:15.560] And they're already overwhelmed by just thinking about a website because they don't even know where to start.
[00:09:15.560 --> 00:09:18.120] Well, first of all, I would just say, I get it.
[00:09:18.120 --> 00:09:19.640] It feels overwhelming.
[00:09:19.640 --> 00:09:22.440] And we just said, like, your website can be your star salesman.
[00:09:22.440 --> 00:09:23.480] Like, it could be so great.
[00:09:23.480 --> 00:09:26.200] And you're like, cool, but like, how do I get that?
[00:09:26.200 --> 00:09:26.760] Right.
[00:09:26.760 --> 00:09:33.400] And I think the biggest thing that I would tell people is, like, you do not have to build Roam from scratch.
[00:09:33.400 --> 00:09:39.400] You do not need to all of a sudden figure out how to reinvent the website wheel because you don't have time for that.
[00:09:39.400 --> 00:09:42.520] Like, you're trying to get 50 grams of protein a day, like, you know, a meal.
[00:09:42.520 --> 00:09:46.600] Like, this, we, we do not have time to figure out how to design websites from scratch.
[00:09:46.600 --> 00:09:50.040] And so, that's where I feel like I would say start with a template.
[00:09:50.040 --> 00:09:55.640] Like, you do not need to pay a professional $50,000 or figure it out yourself.
[00:09:55.640 --> 00:09:58.920] That is like not the binary decision that we have to make.
[00:09:58.920 --> 00:10:00.680] It's 2025.
[00:10:00.680 --> 00:10:02.280] There's a template for that.
[00:10:02.280 --> 00:10:09.880] And so, now with the advent of things like Canva, we recognize how much time we can save by not starting from scratch.
[00:10:09.880 --> 00:10:18.200] With AI, like when you don't have a blank page in front of you, or even a custom designer that's like, yeah, I can do that in a year and a half.
[00:10:18.200 --> 00:10:23.160] When you have a template that you can plug and play into, it's so beneficial.
[00:10:23.160 --> 00:10:32.520] And I was thinking about this the other day because my husband, Aaron, and I just launched an Airbnb locally, and I'm a designer, a web designer, not an interior designer.
[00:10:32.520 --> 00:10:36.600] And I am like trying to cobble everything together literally from scratch.
[00:10:36.600 --> 00:10:51.360] And I told my husband, I'm like, man, if there was like a Scandinavian living room template that I could just like hit add to card on, I would throw my credit card at that company so quickly because I hated starting from scratch.
[00:10:44.680 --> 00:10:54.800] I ordered five different rugs because they didn't fit.
[00:10:54.800 --> 00:10:55.920] And I am a designer.
[00:10:55.920 --> 00:10:56.880] This is what I do.
[00:10:56.880 --> 00:11:06.640] So I think when you start with a template, it's kind of like you're moving into this gorgeous, fully furnished home where someone's made all of the big decisions for you.
[00:11:06.640 --> 00:11:12.960] You know, the couch is going to fit and it's going to match the coffee table, and these curtains are going to be the right length.
[00:11:12.960 --> 00:11:14.720] They have made the big decisions.
[00:11:14.720 --> 00:11:20.720] So you can just hang some art and stock the fridge and personalize it to you and go.
[00:11:20.720 --> 00:11:36.240] And I think that peace of mind of like knowing someone strategically thought through all of these decisions is such a game changer because then you can just do the fun part and say, okay, putting in my work, putting in some copy that sounds like a human, the hard part was done for you.
[00:11:36.240 --> 00:11:39.040] And so I think that that is just a huge thing I would say.
[00:11:39.040 --> 00:11:42.000] If you're feeling overwhelmed, don't start from scratch.
[00:11:42.000 --> 00:11:46.400] Like start from something that someone has already considered all of the hard stuff.
[00:11:46.400 --> 00:11:47.440] Oh my gosh.
[00:11:47.440 --> 00:11:50.640] I couldn't agree more in so many ways.
[00:11:50.640 --> 00:11:56.720] And I'm laughing because I am thinking back to the days where I tried to be like an HTML coder.
[00:11:56.720 --> 00:12:04.880] Like I tried to take my MySpace knowledge of making a cool sidebar onto WordPress.
[00:12:04.880 --> 00:12:17.440] And I then ended up in like website jail having a developer overseas where I just needed to change the year on my wedding website of like pricing for whatever year it was.
[00:12:17.440 --> 00:12:21.200] And it would take two weeks and cost like $200.
[00:12:21.200 --> 00:12:25.040] And it's just fascinating because I feel like there are two camps.
[00:12:25.040 --> 00:12:40.360] People do feel like it's this binary thing where it's like, either I'm going to be scrappy and I'm going to figure this all out by myself and I'm going to DIY it, but it's going to take me like two years to get it done, or I need to go fully custom and it's going to take months and months and months of time.
[00:12:40.360 --> 00:12:48.520] It's funny, Jen, how many people who have beautifully established businesses will reach out to me and they'll be like, I need to work with Jen.
[00:12:48.520 --> 00:12:55.640] And I'm like, you can work with her and you can buy one of her templates because it is going to save you so much time.
[00:12:55.640 --> 00:12:58.280] It is going to save Jen so much time.
[00:12:58.280 --> 00:13:01.080] She puts the best stuff into these things.
[00:13:01.080 --> 00:13:05.000] And so the treatment that I got is based off of her templates.
[00:13:05.000 --> 00:13:08.360] Like you're literally looking at her work in that way.
[00:13:08.360 --> 00:13:08.920] Exactly.
[00:13:08.920 --> 00:13:10.920] And I think like we've had customers reach out.
[00:13:10.920 --> 00:13:14.280] This lady, Emily, reached out to me and she's like, hey, Jen, it was like 7 p.m.
[00:13:14.360 --> 00:13:17.000] And she's like, Jen, like, I'm desperate to work with you.
[00:13:17.000 --> 00:13:18.280] I saw Jenna's website.
[00:13:18.280 --> 00:13:19.560] Like, this is what I need.
[00:13:19.560 --> 00:13:21.000] Like, I just need your genius.
[00:13:21.000 --> 00:13:23.000] I need you to like take a look at this.
[00:13:23.000 --> 00:13:24.440] And I was like, I was reading this email.
[00:13:24.440 --> 00:13:25.000] It's like 7 p.m.
[00:13:25.080 --> 00:13:25.640] I'm not going to respond.
[00:13:25.640 --> 00:13:27.080] I'm like, I'll respond to her in the morning.
[00:13:27.080 --> 00:13:34.440] And I got this email from her the next morning that she was like, after I emailed you, I went to Tonic and started looking at your templates.
[00:13:34.440 --> 00:13:37.080] I realized this one was actually really perfect for me.
[00:13:37.080 --> 00:13:40.440] I customized it and I just hit launch this morning.
[00:13:41.640 --> 00:13:51.480] And like literally for a savings off, you know, she had just paid a developer $75,000 to design a website and then was like in website jail.
[00:13:51.480 --> 00:13:59.880] Like you said, it had this distinct, you know, so many people suffering from website shame out there who are like, Jen, please don't go to my website.
[00:13:59.880 --> 00:14:03.480] And I'm like, oh no, like we do not, we need to break you out of this jail.
[00:14:03.480 --> 00:14:05.240] It can be easier than you think.
[00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:10.840] And yeah, you may not need very few people truly need like a full custom designer.
[00:14:10.840 --> 00:14:18.240] Often you can start with the bones of something, make it yours, and end up with something that you have and are proud of so much faster.
[00:14:18.400 --> 00:14:20.800] So you can get back to doing your job, right?
[00:14:20.800 --> 00:14:25.840] And that's that's the benefit of you no longer have to apologize for your website.
[00:14:25.840 --> 00:14:28.240] And I think that's something that is so powerful.
[00:14:28.240 --> 00:14:32.320] We always say you need a website that can move as fast as you do.
[00:14:32.800 --> 00:14:43.600] And that I think is such a powerful thing because you can show up confidently, you can send up traffic there, you can launch new offers because you have a website that's supporting everything that you do.
[00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:44.240] Oh my gosh.
[00:14:44.240 --> 00:14:44.480] Okay.
[00:14:44.480 --> 00:14:48.800] So the other day, one of my friends sent me a text message of like, hey, what are you working on?
[00:14:48.800 --> 00:14:50.000] And I was like, oh, okay.
[00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:53.680] So I got this idea and I'm building out the sales page and da da da da.
[00:14:53.920 --> 00:14:57.600] And she's like, hold the phone called a sales page.
[00:14:57.600 --> 00:14:58.880] And I was like, yeah.
[00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:04.960] I was like, I have built out literally hundreds of pages on my website.
[00:15:04.960 --> 00:15:05.680] Hundreds.
[00:15:05.680 --> 00:15:08.800] I'm talking about landing pages, thank you pages, confirmation pages.
[00:15:08.800 --> 00:15:12.480] Like, and she was like, wait, you know how to do that?
[00:15:12.480 --> 00:15:16.240] And I was like, yes, I do that every day.
[00:15:16.240 --> 00:15:21.120] Just this weekend, I posted something on Instagram and it was sending it to a page on my website.
[00:15:21.120 --> 00:15:22.640] And I realized a link was broken.
[00:15:22.640 --> 00:15:28.800] And I quickly popped in to my website, changed that link, and updated it within 10 seconds.
[00:15:28.800 --> 00:15:38.320] And it's like, it's fascinating to me how many people cannot access their own sites, cannot tweak them, cannot change them, cannot build them.
[00:15:38.320 --> 00:15:44.800] And it was just, it was eye-opening to me because again, it's like, we're so close to this that I'm like, of course you can do this.
[00:15:44.800 --> 00:15:47.040] This is literally what we do.
[00:15:47.360 --> 00:15:59.440] And it's wild to me because if you do not have control of your website and if you do not feel confident inside of your website, I would argue that you don't even really own your website, right?
[00:15:59.440 --> 00:15:59.880] Absolutely.
[00:15:59.840 --> 00:16:03.080] Your website owns you and your website owns your results.
[00:16:03.400 --> 00:16:13.640] And so the fact that in the year we are in, people still don't feel like they have options and control, it is crazy to me.
[00:16:13.640 --> 00:16:15.400] There is a much better way.
[00:16:15.400 --> 00:16:22.040] So one of the things that you say that I love is that like your website can and should do the heavy lifting for you.
[00:16:22.040 --> 00:16:25.480] And I have seen that time and time again in my own business.
[00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:27.080] What does that actually look like?
[00:16:27.080 --> 00:16:32.360] And like what would somebody need to have in place in order for that to be true?
[00:16:32.360 --> 00:16:39.480] Yeah, I mean, I just think like your website should be hyping your brand when you are at home like ignoring text in your sweatpants.
[00:16:39.480 --> 00:16:43.160] Like your website is always on, so you don't have to be.
[00:16:43.160 --> 00:16:47.560] And so I think that's where the heavy lifting conversion is done on your website.
[00:16:47.880 --> 00:16:51.480] That's where people go when they need to make a buying decision.
[00:16:51.480 --> 00:17:02.440] So all of your efforts on social media, on email, and on these things become really about how do I get people from this place to my website knowing that it's going to convert.
[00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:07.880] And that is an incredibly powerful thing because then are you having to sell everyone on Instagram?
[00:17:07.880 --> 00:17:08.360] No.
[00:17:08.600 --> 00:17:22.600] Then you just get to show up and engage and create content you actually like and say, okay, I know people are going to like this enough that they're going to go to my website or they're going to go download this freebie and then they're going to read about it and they're going to go to my website to learn more.
[00:17:22.600 --> 00:17:25.000] And that's when your website does the heavy lifting.
[00:17:25.000 --> 00:17:28.360] It is the end result that you're sending people every time.
[00:17:28.360 --> 00:17:33.240] And I think what most people don't realize is that that's already happening for better or for worse.
[00:17:33.240 --> 00:17:33.640] Yes.
[00:17:33.640 --> 00:17:39.960] When someone sees your content or they go, like, ooh, I love this photographer, or wow, this coach looks amazing.
[00:17:39.960 --> 00:17:41.320] Where do they go?
[00:17:41.320 --> 00:17:42.520] They go to your website.
[00:17:42.520 --> 00:17:45.000] They go, okay, is this as good as I think it is?
[00:17:45.040 --> 00:17:51.520] And it's kind of like when you see a restaurant on social media or when you look at a storefront, you're like, well, I'm going to go inside.
[00:17:51.520 --> 00:17:54.480] Like, I can't buy anything from the street, you know?
[00:17:54.480 --> 00:17:58.560] And so they're going to go inside and that's where they validate your offer.
[00:17:58.560 --> 00:18:02.000] That's where they go, are you the person I think you are?
[00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:05.040] Or I have 47 tabs open.
[00:18:05.040 --> 00:18:06.400] Which person am I going to pick?
[00:18:06.400 --> 00:18:10.480] I'm going to pick the person that I resonate with the most on their website.
[00:18:10.480 --> 00:18:24.000] And so your website has to do the heavy lifting, but more than that, it means that when you have a website set in place that can do it, you can have the peace of mind of knowing your only job then becomes get people to the website.
[00:18:24.000 --> 00:18:29.120] And so everything changed for us on Instagram, on email, and all of these places.
[00:18:29.120 --> 00:18:38.800] When I stopped trying to sell our website templates on social media and sell them in my emails and sell them in all these places where it was like, go take a look at this.
[00:18:38.800 --> 00:18:40.320] Or like, here, you like us?
[00:18:40.320 --> 00:18:43.760] Like, you're going to go to our website and we know that you're going to convert.
[00:18:43.760 --> 00:18:52.080] And so that's something that I think is such an underutilized tool in most people's business because they simply don't know that that's even possible.
[00:18:52.080 --> 00:18:56.880] And so I think you asked, like, what are the biggest things that you need for that to happen?
[00:18:56.880 --> 00:19:03.840] And I think really there are just three primary things that you need for your website to be this place where it can convert no matter what.
[00:19:03.840 --> 00:19:06.080] And the first one is just clarity.
[00:19:06.400 --> 00:19:16.160] And this is the biggest one people miss because I can't tell you how many website audits I do where I land on someone's beautiful website and it says like, tale as old as time.
[00:19:16.880 --> 00:19:18.640] What does that mean?
[00:19:19.280 --> 00:19:21.520] And I'm like, oh, they're a baker.
[00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:23.760] Like, wow, never saw that coming.
[00:19:23.760 --> 00:19:26.800] You know, so immediate clarity, right?
[00:19:26.800 --> 00:19:30.120] Like, I'm talking, think like a caveman.
[00:19:29.840 --> 00:19:31.640] And we've been guilty of this before.
[00:19:31.960 --> 00:19:37.720] We called our templates customizable websites for so long because we didn't like the word template.
[00:19:37.720 --> 00:19:40.120] And people were like, so are these templates?
[00:19:40.120 --> 00:19:41.560] And we're like, oh, yes.
[00:19:42.520 --> 00:19:44.680] Like, think like a cavemance.
[00:19:44.760 --> 00:19:46.120] Make it super simple.
[00:19:46.120 --> 00:19:49.160] And so my hat for this, I call it an eyebrow.
[00:19:49.160 --> 00:19:55.000] And so you can have a beautiful tagline that says, like, timeless moments captured forever.
[00:19:55.000 --> 00:20:01.400] And in smaller texts, right above that headline, it should say San Antonio wedding photographer.
[00:20:01.720 --> 00:20:04.200] So people go, Okay, I know exactly what this is.
[00:20:04.200 --> 00:20:06.280] So that first one is clarity.
[00:20:06.280 --> 00:20:08.680] That is something you can go to your website right now.
[00:20:08.680 --> 00:20:16.040] I want you to look at it as if you were a caveman or someone's grandmother or a seven-year-old and be like, What do I do?
[00:20:16.040 --> 00:20:17.320] What is this that I offer?
[00:20:17.320 --> 00:20:18.280] So that's number one.
[00:20:18.280 --> 00:20:21.080] The second one is just a clear path.
[00:20:21.080 --> 00:20:28.920] And I want to talk about this a little bit more in a second, but you need to guide them like a GPS to your offer.
[00:20:28.920 --> 00:20:34.920] You need to have a specific path that people are taking to get to what you do.
[00:20:34.920 --> 00:20:36.840] And it needs to be clear and intentional.
[00:20:36.840 --> 00:20:41.880] This is not like a museum tour where they are going through the Louvre with no plan in mind.
[00:20:41.880 --> 00:20:46.920] This is like, how do we get them to take this specific action on your website?
[00:20:46.920 --> 00:20:54.840] Maybe it's a book now button, maybe it's your services, but take them to that place and make all roads lead to Rome, right?
[00:20:54.840 --> 00:20:57.160] That you have not built from scratch.
[00:20:57.160 --> 00:20:58.920] And then the last one, so we have clarity.
[00:20:58.920 --> 00:20:59.960] We have a clear path.
[00:20:59.960 --> 00:21:02.680] And then the last one is just proof.
[00:21:02.680 --> 00:21:09.880] And I think this is the big one because in 2025, really what's changed in the past year is that the buyer's journey used to look like this.
[00:21:10.040 --> 00:21:13.640] It was like, see something you want, buy the thing you want.
[00:21:13.640 --> 00:21:17.280] You know, that was like a simpler time back in like the mid-2000s.
[00:21:17.280 --> 00:21:18.640] Back in the day.
[00:21:18.960 --> 00:21:20.320] It used to be so easy.
[00:21:14.840 --> 00:21:21.040] And you know this too.
[00:21:21.200 --> 00:21:23.280] Like we've talked about this privately.
[00:21:23.280 --> 00:21:25.360] The buyer's journey has just stretched.
[00:21:25.360 --> 00:21:30.080] And I think it looks like this now because people have been to therapy.
[00:21:30.080 --> 00:21:31.520] They have boundaries.
[00:21:31.520 --> 00:21:36.320] They have been burned before by brands who overpromised and didn't deliver.
[00:21:36.320 --> 00:21:43.680] And so now you need to prove what you say that you are doing is what you are going to be delivering to this person.
[00:21:43.680 --> 00:21:46.160] That you can do that for them.
[00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:49.360] You have done it for people like them and you are going to do it again.
[00:21:49.360 --> 00:21:56.800] And so you need to have social proof, testimonials, reviews threaded through every buying decision part of your website.
[00:21:56.800 --> 00:22:05.760] And so on your homepage, case studies on the portfolio, back it up, back it up, back it up, back it up, because people need proof.
[00:22:05.760 --> 00:22:13.520] And so if you want to just instantly dramatically increase your site conversions right now, go ask for reviews.
[00:22:13.520 --> 00:22:18.160] If you need some help with that, we can put our favorite review questions in the show notes.
[00:22:18.160 --> 00:22:24.000] You need to know exactly what people say that you can deliver and you need to thread that through your entire website.
[00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:26.000] So those are the three big things.
[00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:30.080] A clear path through your website and then proof that you can deliver on what you're saying.
[00:22:30.080 --> 00:22:33.200] Those are the biggest things that you need to convert your site.
[00:22:33.200 --> 00:22:34.320] Oh, okay.
[00:22:34.320 --> 00:22:35.920] I love this.
[00:22:35.920 --> 00:22:39.440] There's that quote that's like, clear is better than clever.
[00:22:39.440 --> 00:22:46.880] And I think for so long, people were trying to be like cheeky and clever and clarity is queen right now, right?
[00:22:46.880 --> 00:22:48.560] Like that is one thing.
[00:22:48.880 --> 00:23:03.000] And the other thing, too, that I want to back up about what you're saying that I think is so true and something we consistently think about in our business is for a long time, brands and like the people behind the brands were the hero of the story, right?
[00:23:03.320 --> 00:23:09.560] And now it is like, how do you make the person scrolling the hero of the story and you are the guide, right?
[00:23:09.560 --> 00:23:11.240] That's a way different positioning.
[00:23:11.240 --> 00:23:13.960] Donald Miller teaches this in Story Brand.
[00:23:13.960 --> 00:23:14.520] It's beautiful.
[00:23:14.520 --> 00:23:18.440] It's like you are not the hero of their story, you are the guide.
[00:23:18.440 --> 00:23:29.720] And if you want to position yourself in a way that helps people trust that what you say is true, you need to show them how they are the hero of their own journey and you are simply the guide.
[00:23:29.720 --> 00:23:31.800] And I think that shifts a lot of language.
[00:23:31.800 --> 00:23:33.240] I think that shifts a lot of marketing.
[00:23:33.240 --> 00:23:40.360] And I also think, to your point, that shifts like the need to show that you have guided other people successfully and not just yourself.
[00:23:40.360 --> 00:23:41.880] It's just incredible.
[00:23:41.880 --> 00:23:43.560] And I think that what you're saying is so true.
[00:23:43.560 --> 00:23:55.240] And one of the things that I love to ask people is: what is it about you and your story and your unique talents that makes you uniquely equipped to get your people what they want?
[00:23:55.240 --> 00:23:58.200] That is what your website needs to convey, right?
[00:23:58.520 --> 00:24:01.480] For me, it's like I'm a trained journalist.
[00:24:01.480 --> 00:24:03.240] I love to tell a great story.
[00:24:03.240 --> 00:24:05.960] My medium happens to be design, right?
[00:24:05.960 --> 00:24:09.640] Like I love the words, the visual narrative of a brand.
[00:24:09.640 --> 00:24:12.120] And so that makes me a unique designer.
[00:24:12.120 --> 00:24:18.040] It's also something that's threaded through everything that I do because I believe a website is really a great story told visually.
[00:24:18.040 --> 00:24:19.880] And so that's in all of the templates.
[00:24:19.880 --> 00:24:21.800] They have a story-driven format.
[00:24:21.800 --> 00:24:25.800] And we now know that like stories people remember six times more than facts.
[00:24:25.800 --> 00:24:29.080] And so all of these things, that's what makes me a unique designer.
[00:24:29.080 --> 00:24:30.200] That's what we offer.
[00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:31.240] That's what I sell.
[00:24:31.240 --> 00:24:34.280] And so that allows me to tell that part of my story.
[00:24:34.280 --> 00:24:37.400] That becomes like reasonable and interesting and part of my story.
[00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:38.760] I'm not just telling something.
[00:24:38.760 --> 00:24:46.000] I'm saying, no, no, no, this isn't really about me because this is what allows me to get you what you want, which is a website that tells your story well.
[00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:54.320] So if you're stuck on like what makes you different, think what about me it makes me uniquely equipped to get my people what they want.
[00:24:54.320 --> 00:24:57.120] And if you don't know, the best thing is just to ask.
[00:24:57.120 --> 00:25:03.440] Ask a couple of your friends, ask a couple of your clients, hey, was there anything that you felt like was unique about my approach?
[00:25:03.440 --> 00:25:05.120] What did you love about working with me?
[00:25:05.120 --> 00:25:10.000] You're going to start to hear these word bubbles form of the same things over and over.
[00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:14.880] And that's what I think is so special about brand positioning because then you know, put that on your website, baby.
[00:25:14.880 --> 00:25:16.160] Like, let's go.
[00:25:16.160 --> 00:25:16.640] Yes.
[00:25:16.640 --> 00:25:17.440] Oh my gosh.
[00:25:17.440 --> 00:25:18.480] I love that.
[00:25:18.800 --> 00:25:24.240] I want to pause here for just a sec and thank our sponsors who help bring conversations like this one to life.
[00:25:24.240 --> 00:25:28.480] If you've been nodding along thinking, wait, maybe my site is doing me dirty.
[00:25:28.480 --> 00:25:30.000] Well, you're not alone.
[00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:38.000] After this break, we're diving into what most people get totally wrong about their websites and how to finally make yours a tool that works for you.
[00:25:39.280 --> 00:25:47.280] Running a business means wearing every hat, creating content one minute, handling customer service the next, then trying to figure out shipping logistics.
[00:25:47.520 --> 00:25:49.440] It can get overwhelming fast.
[00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:55.600] When you're building your dreams, finding the right tool that not only helps but simplifies everything is a game changer.
[00:25:55.600 --> 00:25:59.280] For millions of businesses, that tool is Shopify.
[00:25:59.920 --> 00:26:08.720] Shopify powers millions of businesses worldwide and 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S., from Gymshark and Mattel to brands just starting out.
[00:26:08.720 --> 00:26:13.040] With hundreds of ready-to-use templates, you can create a store that matches your brand.
[00:26:13.040 --> 00:26:18.800] Shopify's AI tools write product descriptions and even headlines so you can create content faster.
[00:26:18.800 --> 00:26:23.680] Plus, with their built-in email and social tools, it's like having a marketing team in your back pocket.
[00:26:23.680 --> 00:26:29.120] From inventory to shipping to returns, Shopify is the partner every entrepreneur needs.
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[00:26:52.360 --> 00:26:58.680] This podcast is brought to you by Mercury, banking that helps entrepreneurs do more with their money.
[00:26:58.680 --> 00:27:03.480] When I first started taking my business seriously, I remember feeling stretched thin.
[00:27:03.480 --> 00:27:08.600] I was juggling invoices, tracking payments, and managing cash flow across different tools.
[00:27:08.600 --> 00:27:12.040] It was messy, and I thought banking had to be that way.
[00:27:12.040 --> 00:27:14.520] That's why I was impressed with Mercury.
[00:27:14.520 --> 00:27:24.200] Unlike traditional banking that feels clunky and outdated, Mercury is designed to make managing money effortless so that you can focus on what actually grows your business.
[00:27:24.200 --> 00:27:32.600] Everything you need is in one intuitive product: banking, cards, spend management, invoicing, and more, all in one place.
[00:27:32.600 --> 00:27:35.880] Plus, Mercury flexes to fit all types of businesses.
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[00:27:49.800 --> 00:27:53.160] For important details, check the show notes.
[00:27:53.800 --> 00:28:01.800] You know what's interesting is that I think a lot of times when people think about a website, they think about like the bare bones of it.
[00:28:02.120 --> 00:28:12.600] And what I think a lot of people don't consider is the fact that there are so many frameworks inside of a successful website, right?
[00:28:13.000 --> 00:28:18.320] It is not just like a hero image and a menu at the top and a contact button.
[00:28:14.840 --> 00:28:21.440] There are specific psychological things.
[00:28:21.760 --> 00:28:35.040] There are different selling tactics that can be woven in so incredibly thoughtfully, where you are really thinking about the positioning of the image, but also what sort of copy would go well at this point of the journey.
[00:28:35.040 --> 00:28:42.400] And then as you scroll down, what would be the next logical thing someone would need to know, believe, or understand in order to continue on?
[00:28:42.400 --> 00:28:44.800] And it's like when you think of a funnel, right?
[00:28:44.800 --> 00:29:04.640] If I think of cooking in the kitchen with my mom and pouring the flour in, a funnel, much as a sales funnel in terms of an email funnel, is very similar to a website when built properly, where as people continue to scroll, they continue to figure out and qualify themselves as a potential customer.
[00:29:04.640 --> 00:29:10.560] And I think that so many entrepreneurs get easily exhausted because they feel like they're constantly selling.
[00:29:10.560 --> 00:29:33.120] But I think when we really do think about this heavy lifting idea, the idea that your website shouldn't just be this generic place to land, but it should be thoughtfully structured in a systematic way that allows people to continue to qualify themselves as potential customers so that as they continue to scroll, they are qualifying themselves saying, Yes, this is what I'm looking for.
[00:29:33.120 --> 00:29:34.080] Yes, this is for me.
[00:29:34.080 --> 00:29:36.240] Oh my gosh, yes, I want that result.
[00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:43.360] And so there is a lot of scientific backing to a beautiful website, right?
[00:29:43.360 --> 00:29:47.760] It's not just what it looks like, it's how it makes somebody feel.
[00:29:47.760 --> 00:29:48.880] Absolutely.
[00:29:48.880 --> 00:29:49.200] Yeah.
[00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:52.800] And I think a lot of people don't realize like the strategy that goes into it.
[00:29:52.800 --> 00:29:56.480] And that's my job as a designer and as a template designer.
[00:29:56.480 --> 00:30:01.960] My job is to think: okay, what does someone need on this services page to make a buying decision?
[00:30:02.280 --> 00:30:09.560] How can I make this about page not just about this person, but ultimately make someone go, This is the person that I've been looking for.
[00:30:09.560 --> 00:30:13.160] This is the only person I can now imagine working with, right?
[00:30:13.160 --> 00:30:15.160] Like, I'm a little in love with this brand.
[00:30:15.160 --> 00:30:26.920] And so, there's so much strategy, there's so much possibility that goes into web design, which is why I'm just such a nerd about it because I love figuring out: wait a second, how do we sell beautifully?
[00:30:26.920 --> 00:30:28.520] How do we sell ethically?
[00:30:28.520 --> 00:30:29.960] How do we sell well?
[00:30:29.960 --> 00:30:31.800] How do we build that liquid depth?
[00:30:31.800 --> 00:30:37.400] Like, oh, wow, this is unique and different brand in a sea of everything that looks and sounds the same.
[00:30:37.400 --> 00:30:44.680] And so, I think that it's just incredible to see when you browse a well-done website, you go, ooh, this feels amazing.
[00:30:44.680 --> 00:30:48.440] And I think that's why, like, people come to me about your website all the time.
[00:30:48.440 --> 00:30:52.040] Every single time we've redone it, people have been like, Wow, there's something about this.
[00:30:52.040 --> 00:30:57.560] And I think that's what they're not realizing is like that's what they're seeing is like the level of intention behind it.
[00:30:57.560 --> 00:31:00.840] And that's what I think can be so effective when you put those pieces together.
[00:31:00.840 --> 00:31:01.720] Oh my gosh.
[00:31:01.720 --> 00:31:08.920] Okay, so I want to flash this back a handful of years to when Jen came to my house.
[00:31:08.920 --> 00:31:14.680] We lived in a hundred-year-old craftsman on the river in Wisconsin.
[00:31:14.680 --> 00:31:16.280] I greeted Jen at the door.
[00:31:16.280 --> 00:31:21.000] I had on this classic vintage sweatshirt that I stole from my father-in-law.
[00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:22.200] Thank you, Russ.
[00:31:22.200 --> 00:31:26.840] That has a bear with antlers, and then it just says beer with a question mark on it.
[00:31:27.000 --> 00:31:28.360] I think he was drinking a beer.
[00:31:28.360 --> 00:31:31.400] Like, I have this memory of the deer, like, maybe drinking a beer.
[00:31:31.480 --> 00:31:33.480] I was very not classy.
[00:31:33.480 --> 00:31:36.920] And Jen and I sat down at this table.
[00:31:36.920 --> 00:31:43.960] And one of the things that I have always had to figure out, and so many people in my audience are also struggling.
[00:31:43.960 --> 00:33:22.920] You, the listener, might be thinking this is like how can you have a website be effective if you want to do more than one thing right because i am a multi-passionate entrepreneur i've always been and i think that a lot of my listeners are like this is awesome but like i don't want to lock myself into one thing for the next 10 years or i can't imagine not doing all of the things that make me me and i remember we literally had papers out and we were mapping out because at the time i was a wedding photographer but i was also starting the digital side of my company building your first course yes of course how do i not confuse brides or deter them but also how do i speak to other photographers and so what would you say like how can you structure a website let's say if somebody's listening and maybe they're testing out different ideas or they have multiple offers or their business spans many different passions how do you not make it confusing or chaotic yeah i mean it's a great question and like you know going to your current site now there's so much like you contain multitudes you know but i do too like as adhd entrepreneurs like i'm ever going to do one thing no that's never going to happen so so anyway i think that this is just such a common thing you know and so if you're struggling to figure out how your offers are going to work together just know that like this is the most common problem that i see in website design and i think a lot of it just goes down to clarity and clear signpost and so for example for you it was as simple as being like, okay, there are kind of two customers that are visiting this site: people who are brides and people who are looking for business coaching.
[00:33:22.920 --> 00:33:26.600] And so we are going to make it caveman stupid simple.
[00:33:26.600 --> 00:33:28.920] If you are a bride, click here.
[00:33:28.920 --> 00:33:32.280] And so it was like a top menu item: brides.
[00:33:32.280 --> 00:33:36.760] And it was like very clear: weddings, you know, super simple offer.
[00:33:36.760 --> 00:33:43.960] And so one of the biggest things I think is a huge opportunity is creating those divisions of offers in your site menu.
[00:33:43.960 --> 00:33:50.280] And so maybe if you are a, this is the most common one I see, wedding photographer or photographer and business coach.
[00:33:50.280 --> 00:34:00.360] And so it could be as simple as weddings, coaching, you know, and your about section can be a little bit about both, but really treating those as individual sales pages.
[00:34:00.360 --> 00:34:11.800] And the way I think about it is that your website is like an incredible hostess at a restaurant who they are going to take you where you need to go and you're going to be guided to the chair.
[00:34:11.800 --> 00:34:13.160] It's going to be pulled out for you.
[00:34:13.160 --> 00:34:14.520] And it's like, here you are.
[00:34:14.520 --> 00:34:15.560] Here's the menu.
[00:34:15.560 --> 00:34:16.520] Here's what you need.
[00:34:16.520 --> 00:34:17.560] It's brunch.
[00:34:17.560 --> 00:34:18.680] Like here's the menu.
[00:34:18.680 --> 00:34:20.920] And so I think that's what the website needs to do.
[00:34:20.920 --> 00:34:23.480] It needs to guide people to the right decision.
[00:34:23.480 --> 00:34:28.200] And my best advice is always to make it as simple and clear as possible.
[00:34:28.200 --> 00:34:38.600] And so it could be as simple as having two things underneath your menu that it's like for brides, for coaching, or like this service, this service, this service.
[00:34:38.600 --> 00:34:40.520] Here are three ways to work with me.
[00:34:40.520 --> 00:34:43.960] And our brains are very much created to value order.
[00:34:43.960 --> 00:34:48.280] And so I'm a big fan, and you'll see this in lots of our templates of a one, two, three.
[00:34:48.280 --> 00:34:51.000] Here's this, here's this, and here's this.
[00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:58.600] And so people know as soon as they click that decision, they're going to be taken to a page that makes sense for specifically that offer.
[00:34:58.600 --> 00:35:03.160] And so I recommend having like a sales page, kind of specifically for each.
[00:35:03.160 --> 00:35:06.200] We build like a mini sales page into each of our templates.
[00:35:06.200 --> 00:35:10.440] So it might say weddings, and everything on that page is going to be exactly what you need.
[00:35:10.440 --> 00:35:11.720] It could say coaching.
[00:35:11.720 --> 00:35:14.040] It's going to go, everything is going to be on that page.
[00:35:14.040 --> 00:35:17.120] You're going to give them the information that they need to make that buying decision.
[00:35:17.440 --> 00:35:31.200] So I think the biggest thing is just starting with the paper, right, or starting with your Google Doc that maps out who's visiting the site, what information do they need to make that decision to know, like, and trust me that I can do this.
[00:35:31.200 --> 00:35:32.400] What do they need to know?
[00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:33.680] What do they need to do?
[00:35:34.000 --> 00:35:35.360] And then what do they need to do next?
[00:35:35.360 --> 00:35:41.280] What is the call to action that they're going to take at the end of this little mini funnel on those pages?
[00:35:41.280 --> 00:35:49.280] But the biggest thing is really just having that clarity at the front end of who's visiting and what actions are they going to take to find out more information.
[00:35:49.280 --> 00:35:49.760] Yes.
[00:35:49.760 --> 00:35:50.560] Oh my gosh.
[00:35:50.560 --> 00:35:51.120] I love it.
[00:35:51.120 --> 00:35:56.640] And I think sometimes people get so overwhelmed because they're like, I need eight different websites.
[00:35:56.720 --> 00:36:02.720] It's like, no, no, no, you can have one home that very clearly helps people know where to go, right?
[00:36:02.720 --> 00:36:07.360] Like you can very thoughtfully do it without alienating anyone.
[00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:14.800] Because also, if you're multi-passionate, there's a good chance that the people that you are serving are also that way too, and they might see themselves in you.
[00:36:15.120 --> 00:36:30.240] Really quickly, on your homepage, we decided very quickly that they needed to first know who you are, but we didn't immediately go into your courses next or even the podcast next because the most important place for them to go on your website was to your freebies.
[00:36:30.240 --> 00:36:35.760] Because as you talk about all the time, like your email list is where you do the vast majority of your selling, us too.
[00:36:35.760 --> 00:36:37.280] It's website and email.
[00:36:37.280 --> 00:36:43.920] And so the first thing that was the priority was like, let's have a beautiful freebie, a beautiful selection of freebies.
[00:36:43.920 --> 00:36:48.160] And based on the freebie they chose, you're going to kind of know what they're most interested in.
[00:36:48.160 --> 00:36:50.800] And so that was the most important thing.
[00:36:50.800 --> 00:36:53.520] A lot of other people would have said, well, just put the podcast.
[00:36:53.520 --> 00:36:55.520] Like, that's probably where people know her from.
[00:36:55.520 --> 00:36:56.720] Put that up top.
[00:36:56.720 --> 00:36:59.280] No, we wanted them to see this no matter what.
[00:36:59.280 --> 00:37:06.520] And so that decision of having those be beautiful, immediately eye-catching, near the top, we knew we wanted people to take that action.
[00:37:06.840 --> 00:37:09.000] And so that's what we prioritize first.
[00:37:09.000 --> 00:37:18.600] Well, and also from a strategic standpoint, if we just send people to the podcast, which thank you for being here, I don't know who you are.
[00:37:18.600 --> 00:37:18.920] Yeah.
[00:37:18.920 --> 00:37:21.000] I have no way to get in touch with you.
[00:37:21.000 --> 00:37:29.240] If three months from now I have something that you would want, there is no certified way to make sure that you get it, right?
[00:37:29.720 --> 00:37:50.760] And so when we're thinking about it from a strategic standpoint too, if you're doing all of this work to get somebody onto your website and you're not thoughtfully considering how can I make sure I stay in touch and can continue to serve them, then that is a huge missed opportunity because your website can absolutely do the heavy lifting and the selling for you.
[00:37:50.760 --> 00:37:55.400] But a lot of times too, people are in their research phase or their planning phase.
[00:37:55.400 --> 00:38:15.560] And so if there's a way that you can capture their information and stay in touch with them, then as Jen said, as this longer tail sales process that we're often seeing now happens, the more that you show up and serve them, the more likely they are to buy from you, whether it's immediately today or it's six months from now.
[00:38:15.560 --> 00:38:20.680] And so when we were even planning out the website, it's not just like, well, what are you most known for?
[00:38:20.760 --> 00:38:22.120] Where can we send people to?
[00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:28.520] It's like, how do we actually build something that we own and have control over that experience?
[00:38:28.520 --> 00:38:36.120] Your website is pretty much the only place on the entire web where you are in control of someone's experience.
[00:38:36.120 --> 00:38:38.680] I can't control somebody's experience on YouTube.
[00:38:38.680 --> 00:38:41.400] I can't control somebody's experience on this podcast.
[00:38:41.400 --> 00:38:45.920] After you listen to the show, there's probably other recommended shows or other things are popping up.
[00:38:45.920 --> 00:38:47.040] I don't know.
[00:38:47.040 --> 00:38:57.200] And so, what's so beautiful about a website is like you are in control of that experience of how they move through it, but also what happens after it.
[00:38:57.200 --> 00:39:09.440] And that's why I think there is so much beautiful and thoughtful strategy when it comes to a website in thinking through those types of things so that it's doing all the work for you, right?
[00:39:09.440 --> 00:39:16.800] Whether it is making the immediate sale or capturing somebody's information so that you can serve them and then eventually sell to them.
[00:39:16.800 --> 00:39:20.480] I can't tell you how many people who are like, oh, I've been on your email list for six months.
[00:39:20.480 --> 00:39:22.400] Like, I found you online.
[00:39:22.400 --> 00:39:23.200] I found you on social.
[00:39:23.200 --> 00:39:23.920] I went to your website.
[00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:24.640] I got this freebie.
[00:39:24.640 --> 00:39:25.600] I've been here for six months.
[00:39:25.600 --> 00:39:26.880] Like, I've been saving up.
[00:39:26.880 --> 00:39:34.400] Now I'm buying, you know, and it was all because of that through line experience of they waited, they researched, they got all the information.
[00:39:34.400 --> 00:39:36.000] They read every page of our website.
[00:39:36.000 --> 00:39:37.040] Like, we can see the back end.
[00:39:37.040 --> 00:39:39.600] Like, oh, you spent 13 minutes on our website.
[00:39:39.600 --> 00:39:40.400] Amazing.
[00:39:40.400 --> 00:39:44.320] And so then they have that time, but we have the information that we need.
[00:39:44.320 --> 00:39:51.280] And that's like we build freebies and we build pop-ups, we build everything into the websites because you need to know those people.
[00:39:51.280 --> 00:39:55.440] Every other platform is really trying to keep you from knowing those people, right?
[00:39:55.440 --> 00:39:59.200] They are making it difficult for you to have any reach to your audience.
[00:39:59.200 --> 00:40:02.800] But when someone's on your website, you have their full attention.
[00:40:02.800 --> 00:40:04.400] And that is so impactful.
[00:40:04.400 --> 00:40:07.200] That attention currency is so valuable.
[00:40:07.200 --> 00:40:09.520] And so what are you going to do with it once you have them?
[00:40:09.520 --> 00:40:10.640] It's so important.
[00:40:10.640 --> 00:40:11.040] Yes.
[00:40:11.040 --> 00:40:11.440] Okay.
[00:40:11.440 --> 00:40:16.160] Let's say someone that is listening, our listener today, they just have one hour.
[00:40:16.160 --> 00:40:21.840] So they have one hour, and they maybe have a website or they're looking at building one.
[00:40:21.840 --> 00:40:24.320] What is one high-impact change?
[00:40:24.320 --> 00:40:34.920] Let's say for somebody that has a website that they could make today that could help move the needle on I love this question because I do think people mostly approach it as an all-or-nothing.
[00:40:29.840 --> 00:40:44.040] Like, it's like, I'm going to burn my website down and rise like a phoenix from the ashes, and maybe I'll do that in four years because nobody got time for that.
[00:40:44.040 --> 00:40:49.480] I'm a big proponent of like, just make it a little better, like, just make it a little bit better today.
[00:40:49.800 --> 00:40:52.680] First piece of advice: start where the money is, right?
[00:40:52.680 --> 00:40:56.280] So, start where people are making a buying decision on your website.
[00:40:56.280 --> 00:41:03.000] Maybe that's your services page, maybe it's your coaching page or your course page, whatever it is you're selling.
[00:41:03.000 --> 00:41:09.800] How could you maybe add more social proof to that page and say, Okay, I have some updated testimonials, I'm gonna do that.
[00:41:09.800 --> 00:41:17.160] Or people are going to my portfolio, but nothing I've posted on Instagram in the past year is actually on my website.
[00:41:17.160 --> 00:41:21.480] So, people are going to my website and it doesn't even match what I'm my work now.
[00:41:21.480 --> 00:41:23.560] So, start where the money is.
[00:41:23.560 --> 00:41:25.800] Make a couple of little upgrades.
[00:41:25.800 --> 00:41:28.120] Add a project to your portfolio.
[00:41:28.120 --> 00:41:32.840] Change the wording to make sure what you're actually selling on your website is what you're currently selling.
[00:41:32.840 --> 00:41:35.720] But start with where people are making that buying decision.
[00:41:35.720 --> 00:41:41.320] And the second one is just look at your above-the-fold headline that we just talked about earlier.
[00:41:41.320 --> 00:41:47.240] Is it abundantly clear what you do immediately when I land on your website, right?
[00:41:47.240 --> 00:41:59.080] Like, within 0.08 seconds, I should have total clarity, caveman simple clarity about what you do and who you are and who you're for, and maybe even who you're not for immediately on your website.
[00:41:59.080 --> 00:42:05.800] So, those are the two things: start where the money is, and then ensure that that above the fold, above the fold, above the rest.
[00:42:05.800 --> 00:42:11.960] Like, priorize that above everything else, and then everything will make sense further on as you go.
[00:42:12.520 --> 00:42:14.960] I love that, and I totally agree.
[00:42:14.600 --> 00:42:18.160] You have to lose the all-or-nothing mentality.
[00:42:18.480 --> 00:42:24.320] You have to lose the perfect like following that and waiting to hit publish.
[00:42:24.320 --> 00:42:28.240] Like, nobody cares about your website as much as you do.
[00:42:28.240 --> 00:42:33.040] And at the same point, like, just published is better than sitting in a draft.
[00:42:33.040 --> 00:42:35.440] Like, just get it out there.
[00:42:36.000 --> 00:42:37.600] You will start to collect data.
[00:42:37.600 --> 00:42:39.200] You will start to see results.
[00:42:39.200 --> 00:42:40.800] You will start to get insights.
[00:42:40.800 --> 00:42:43.040] Like, so get anything out there.
[00:42:43.040 --> 00:42:50.720] I am like the queen of spaghetti at the wall and like constantly just tweaking and refining and building and like moving things around.
[00:42:50.720 --> 00:42:53.200] And, like, I just think get it out there.
[00:42:53.200 --> 00:42:54.640] Like, there it out there.
[00:42:54.640 --> 00:42:55.760] And you can make it better.
[00:42:55.760 --> 00:43:01.520] That's the beauty of the website that you own and that you can edit is that next week you could make it a little bit better.
[00:43:01.520 --> 00:43:02.800] Like, you could add something.
[00:43:02.800 --> 00:43:05.440] You could, you don't have to wait for new brand photos.
[00:43:05.440 --> 00:43:07.520] You could add new brand photos next week.
[00:43:07.520 --> 00:43:13.280] And this is one of the things I love about you as a client is that every six months, you're like, okay, time for some updates.
[00:43:13.280 --> 00:43:14.480] Like, let's make it fresh.
[00:43:14.480 --> 00:43:15.920] Like, how can we improve it?
[00:43:15.920 --> 00:43:24.000] Most people design their website and then they wait until they hate it, which is usually like two weeks later, and then like wait four years to do anything about it.
[00:43:24.000 --> 00:43:24.720] And I'm like, no, no, no.
[00:43:24.880 --> 00:43:27.680] Your website should evolve with you.
[00:43:27.680 --> 00:43:33.280] You want it to represent who you are going to be and who you're becoming, not who you were four years ago.
[00:43:33.280 --> 00:43:38.000] And so this is like your siren call: like, don't think your website is dead.
[00:43:38.000 --> 00:43:41.840] It is a living, breathing representation of your business.
[00:43:41.840 --> 00:43:43.280] So how can you operate it?
[00:43:43.280 --> 00:43:46.400] Like one, because that's when it begins to serve you so well.
[00:43:46.400 --> 00:43:49.040] So don't miss out on that possibility.
[00:43:49.040 --> 00:43:52.880] Before we wrap up, let's thank our sponsors for making this episode possible.
[00:43:52.880 --> 00:44:01.240] And hey, if this conversation sparked a few ideas for your own brand or website, consider sending it to a friend who's in a season of redesign or reinvention.
[00:44:01.240 --> 00:44:09.480] Coming up, I'm sharing a personal story that you haven't heard and the big reason why I keep coming back to Jen again and again.
[00:44:10.440 --> 00:44:14.840] Can we talk about how bad underwear can ruin your entire day?
[00:44:14.840 --> 00:44:18.680] Like I used to put on underwear in a bra knowing that I'd be adjusting it by 10 a.m.
[00:44:18.680 --> 00:44:21.080] and completely over it by lunchtime.
[00:44:21.080 --> 00:44:24.920] That is why I am obsessed with the Skims Fits Everybody collection.
[00:44:24.920 --> 00:44:29.560] Now I've bought Skims for years, but I swear this line is a total game changer.
[00:44:29.560 --> 00:44:35.000] The Fits Everybody scoop ralette has buttery soft fabric that literally feels like nothing.
[00:44:35.000 --> 00:44:36.920] And I mean that in the best way.
[00:44:36.920 --> 00:44:40.040] I can put it on and I forget that it exists.
[00:44:40.040 --> 00:44:45.400] I'm so confident in these pieces that when I packed my Grease suitcase, it was basically all skims.
[00:44:45.400 --> 00:44:51.560] I even wore their bodysuit for a recent branding photo shoot because when something fits this well, you just trust it.
[00:44:51.560 --> 00:44:58.840] When your underwear actually works, you stop wasting precious mental energy on it and you can focus on everything else that matters.
[00:44:58.840 --> 00:45:03.560] If you're tired of uncomfortable intimates, this is your sign to try Fits Everybody.
[00:45:03.560 --> 00:45:07.240] Shop Skims Fits Everybody Collection at skims.com.
[00:45:07.240 --> 00:45:09.960] Once you place your order, make sure to let them know we sent you.
[00:45:09.960 --> 00:45:15.720] Just select podcast in the survey and choose the Gold Digger podcast in the drop-down menu that follows.
[00:45:17.000 --> 00:45:20.760] You know that sinking feeling when you see your latest campaign report?
[00:45:20.760 --> 00:45:24.680] 87% of your budget went to people who would never buy from you?
[00:45:24.680 --> 00:45:30.360] Random scrollers clicking your business course ad, students engaging with your entrepreneur content.
[00:45:30.360 --> 00:45:36.360] You're perfect ad creative about building sustainable income shown to people who aren't even trying to build a business.
[00:45:36.360 --> 00:45:38.600] That's why LinkedIn ads exist.
[00:45:38.600 --> 00:45:43.800] While other platforms guess who might be interested, LinkedIn knows who your buyers are.
[00:45:43.800 --> 00:45:47.680] Target the exact job titles making purchasing decisions.
[00:45:47.680 --> 00:45:50.320] Reach VPs of marketing at growing companies.
[00:45:50.320 --> 00:45:53.040] Find HR directors at mid-sized firms.
[00:45:53.040 --> 00:45:56.000] Target entrepreneurs ready to invest in their growth.
[00:45:56.000 --> 00:45:58.720] Zero waste, maximum impact.
[00:45:58.720 --> 00:46:06.960] Stop hemorrhaging budget on random audiences and start reaching actual decision makers who can write the checks only with LinkedIn ads.
[00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:13.360] Spend $250 on your first campaign on LinkedIn ads and get a free $250 credit for the next one.
[00:46:13.360 --> 00:46:16.240] Just go to linkedin.com/slash goal.
[00:46:16.240 --> 00:46:19.360] That's linkedin.com slash G-O-A-L.
[00:46:19.360 --> 00:46:21.920] Terms and conditions apply.
[00:46:23.200 --> 00:46:25.680] This message is sponsored by Greenlight.
[00:46:25.680 --> 00:46:29.600] My six-year-old woke up this morning asking if she could do chores to earn money.
[00:46:29.600 --> 00:46:30.240] Why?
[00:46:30.240 --> 00:46:34.560] Because she read a fancy Nancy book where Nancy worked to buy fabulous shoes.
[00:46:34.560 --> 00:46:39.920] And suddenly, my daughter wanted to experience the same pride of buying something special with her own money.
[00:46:39.920 --> 00:46:46.000] But here's what hit me: I had no good way to help her actually see and feel her money growing.
[00:46:46.000 --> 00:46:47.440] Cash gets lost.
[00:46:47.440 --> 00:46:53.440] Piggy banks are abstract, and she can't really understand the connection between effort and reward.
[00:46:53.440 --> 00:46:55.440] That's why we started using Greenlight.
[00:46:55.440 --> 00:47:02.240] Greenlight is the easy, convenient way for parents to raise financially smart kids and for families to navigate life together.
[00:47:02.240 --> 00:47:09.840] And maybe that's why millions of parents trust and kids love learning about money on Greenlight, the number one family finance and safety app.
[00:47:09.840 --> 00:47:13.920] Now, when she does chores, I can instantly send her earnings to her card.
[00:47:13.920 --> 00:47:18.800] She watches her balance grow in real time and feels genuine ownership over her money.
[00:47:18.800 --> 00:47:25.120] And when she's ready for those fabulous shoes, she'll swipe her own card and experience that incredible feeling Nancy had.
[00:47:25.120 --> 00:47:27.760] Don't wait to teach your kids real-world money skills.
[00:47:27.760 --> 00:47:32.200] Start your risk-free Green Light trial today at greenlight.com slash gold digger.
[00:47:32.200 --> 00:47:35.400] That's greenlight.com/slash gold digger to get started.
[00:47:35.400 --> 00:47:38.440] Greenlight.com slash gold digger.
[00:47:39.400 --> 00:47:51.560] One final thing I have to share, just because I'm like so proud, but it's just really truly a testament to the power of the platform and the templates is this entire summer we have had our head down.
[00:47:51.560 --> 00:48:07.240] So we've done no launches and we were on our team call yesterday and we realized that over the summer we have updated 10 different landing pages on our own in terms of copy, images, et cetera, using templates.
[00:48:07.240 --> 00:48:08.760] So we didn't really change the design.
[00:48:08.760 --> 00:48:10.200] We just went through.
[00:48:10.200 --> 00:48:14.520] After we did a big survey of our audience, we were like, wow, we have new language.
[00:48:14.520 --> 00:48:15.480] We have new words.
[00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:17.000] We know what their desires are.
[00:48:17.000 --> 00:48:23.960] Okay, how do we go page by page through our site and apply what we now know to be true?
[00:48:23.960 --> 00:48:27.160] And we did it all without even talking to you, right?
[00:48:27.480 --> 00:48:28.120] No idea.
[00:48:28.120 --> 00:48:28.680] So proud.
[00:48:28.680 --> 00:48:29.480] Star student.
[00:48:30.520 --> 00:48:34.120] Probably the best thing is like the mom being like, go, baby, you got this.
[00:48:35.160 --> 00:48:43.160] And so on our team call yesterday, we were like recognizing like, wow, we have gone through so many pages and refined them.
[00:48:43.160 --> 00:48:49.800] We're doing fun things like split testing just the hero sections of pages and seeing which one performs better.
[00:48:49.800 --> 00:48:55.560] Like we are in a place where we can be so crazy strategic because we have control.
[00:48:55.560 --> 00:49:02.480] And so regardless of if you buy a template from Jen or not, if you do not have control of your website.
[00:49:02.480 --> 00:49:13.800] And if you do not feel creatively empowered to log in and move things around and change things and update things, I would argue that now is the time.
[00:49:13.800 --> 00:49:24.800] You need to own your site and you need to not just own it, you need to have the ownership in it that like it is yours to care for, to be creative with, to have fun with.
[00:49:24.800 --> 00:49:30.320] And it changes the entire emotion game feeling around a website.
[00:49:30.320 --> 00:49:34.640] Like I love sending people to my website because I'm like, go, go check it out.
[00:49:34.640 --> 00:49:36.800] It is a party on the internet.
[00:49:36.800 --> 00:49:38.000] It is my home.
[00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:38.880] Come on in.
[00:49:38.880 --> 00:49:50.160] And so I just think for so many people listening who feel stifled or paralyzed or feel like they're not tech savvy enough or who feel trapped or who feel stuck, it doesn't have to be that way.
[00:49:50.160 --> 00:49:51.840] It doesn't have to be that way.
[00:49:51.840 --> 00:49:53.200] It doesn't have to be that way.
[00:49:53.200 --> 00:49:56.720] And people can't miss what they've never had, you know, and that's what I think is the case.
[00:49:56.720 --> 00:50:00.880] Is I'm like, you should be telling the grocery store checkout guy to go to your website, right?
[00:50:00.880 --> 00:50:08.240] Like you should, because, because I can't tell you how many times I'm at a conference, I meet one of the speakers or one of the attendees, they're crushing it.
[00:50:08.240 --> 00:50:10.640] Like followers, content, everything.
[00:50:10.640 --> 00:50:13.120] And they're like, oh, please don't go to my website.
[00:50:13.120 --> 00:50:22.480] And I'm like, well, no, like this is like my, the worst thing I hear on the daily because I'm like, you are too talented to have a website you're embarrassed by.
[00:50:22.480 --> 00:50:24.240] You are too talented.
[00:50:24.240 --> 00:50:26.240] So don't let that happen to you.
[00:50:26.240 --> 00:50:28.000] It doesn't have to be one of our templates.
[00:50:28.000 --> 00:50:30.320] There are resources available to you.
[00:50:30.320 --> 00:50:34.800] And the other thing I want to highlight that you just said is you audited your website.
[00:50:34.800 --> 00:50:36.480] You looked at your website.
[00:50:36.480 --> 00:50:40.000] You went to your website and were like, what could be performing better?
[00:50:40.000 --> 00:50:42.800] And that's something that, like, often, I mean, how long?
[00:50:42.800 --> 00:50:45.840] Like, let's just moment of truth, listening to the podcast.
[00:50:45.840 --> 00:50:51.600] Dear listener, when is the last time you went to your website and looked at it with fresh eyes?
[00:50:51.600 --> 00:50:59.280] Like, I'm a designer, and I can take too long to go to our tonic homepage and go, like, oh, that could use a, that person doesn't work here.
[00:50:59.280 --> 00:51:00.840] Like, or that's an old freebie.
[00:50:59.840 --> 00:51:02.920] You need to look at it with fresh eyes.
[00:51:03.160 --> 00:51:12.840] And one of the things that we did this last year, similar last summer, I was going through our website just trying to find those places where it wasn't converting as high as it needed to.
[00:51:12.840 --> 00:51:21.320] And my brother, who's like this AI genius and is always like pulling me into the future, you know, somewhat against my will, he was like, Hey, let me send you.
[00:51:21.320 --> 00:51:29.400] I actually came up with these really great ChapGBT prompts to help audit your website like it's your ideal customer browsing your website.
[00:51:29.400 --> 00:51:31.000] And so, I sent them to you.
[00:51:31.000 --> 00:51:40.040] They are so helpful because it literally just narrates like what is your ideal customer thinking or feeling as they scroll whatever page you upload.
[00:51:40.040 --> 00:51:41.320] And the prompts were so helpful.
[00:51:41.320 --> 00:51:48.920] And so, basically, it identified all of these things where, like, I thought this was fine on the page, but it was actually creating confusion.
[00:51:48.920 --> 00:51:53.720] Or, like, actually, what our ideal customer was thinking is this sounds too good to be true.
[00:51:53.720 --> 00:51:59.480] Like, I'm overwhelmed by my website, and they're making this sound so easy, but it probably isn't.
[00:51:59.480 --> 00:52:04.760] So, we immediately began to take some of that feedback and be like, Hey, this isn't easy.
[00:52:04.760 --> 00:52:06.120] Websites are overwhelming.
[00:52:06.120 --> 00:52:11.160] We hear it, and that's why we have this amazing support team who's available to help you.
[00:52:11.160 --> 00:52:15.960] That's why we have all of these reviews saying, It was kind of hard, but it was so worth it.
[00:52:15.960 --> 00:52:24.120] So, we were able to take what that audit said and immediately, like you did with your customer reviews and your survey, and incorporate those things back into our website.
[00:52:24.120 --> 00:52:28.120] So, I think we have that on your tonic landing page that we'll mention in a second.
[00:52:28.120 --> 00:52:37.480] But those prompts were just phenomenally helpful in helping us audit our website and just improve, improve, improve, improve, because we own it because we can do that at any time.
[00:52:37.480 --> 00:52:44.040] It's so funny because it'll be like literally like, I just want to change two words, and it takes 10 seconds, right?
[00:52:44.040 --> 00:52:47.920] Like, it doesn't have to be this huge overhaul.
[00:52:48.160 --> 00:52:58.320] Like, it can be these like really subtle shifts in language or the way you're speaking about yourself or your offer or the way that your client speaks about you, right?
[00:52:58.320 --> 00:52:58.800] Yes.
[00:52:58.800 --> 00:53:00.720] And so, oh, it's just amazing.
[00:53:00.720 --> 00:53:01.280] Okay.
[00:53:01.280 --> 00:53:13.440] So, my final question is: what are some of the common things that people include on their sites that are either totally unnecessary or that might be actively hurting their chances of making a sale?
[00:53:13.440 --> 00:53:16.160] And maybe they'll learn this when they audit.
[00:53:16.160 --> 00:53:21.040] Yeah, I mean, I do think that that's where we began to see, like, oh, we have a Pollyanna problem.
[00:53:21.040 --> 00:53:27.760] We have all these things saying, like, it's really easy, and people don't believe that, you know, so we need to actually decrease the friction that someone's feeling.
[00:53:27.760 --> 00:53:28.640] So, that's a huge one.
[00:53:28.640 --> 00:53:33.440] Definitely look at the audit for sure because you're also going to see the information that's like, why is this here?
[00:53:33.440 --> 00:53:35.680] Like, this doesn't make sense to me.
[00:53:35.680 --> 00:53:38.000] It's very humbling, but also helpful.
[00:53:38.000 --> 00:53:39.680] I'm like, this is what we need.
[00:53:39.680 --> 00:53:45.440] But the most common things that I see are just too much information.
[00:53:45.440 --> 00:53:51.120] You are drowning your people in information that is clogging up your website.
[00:53:51.120 --> 00:53:57.680] And so, people are just slogging through every possible thing that they don't need at that exact moment.
[00:53:57.680 --> 00:54:05.360] And so, you want to think, like, what does someone need to know or believe that's going to help them get more information about this product?
[00:54:05.360 --> 00:54:09.760] Like, what do they need to know or believe or what action do they need to take?
[00:54:09.760 --> 00:54:12.880] How can I give them that and give them that thoroughly, right?
[00:54:12.880 --> 00:54:17.760] But we're not drowning them in, like, when I was six, when I first picked up a camera, right?
[00:54:17.760 --> 00:54:19.120] They don't care how old you were.
[00:54:19.200 --> 00:54:21.200] They care how you use the camera now, right?
[00:54:21.200 --> 00:54:26.400] So, those are the things I would say: like, think through strategically the information that you're including.
[00:54:26.400 --> 00:54:28.720] So, it's not just every possible thing.
[00:54:28.720 --> 00:54:33.880] You know, if you were a bride, you don't need to know at the very front of the process how much an album costs.
[00:54:34.440 --> 00:54:37.880] That information is not relevant to that person at that part of their buying journey.
[00:54:37.880 --> 00:54:38.280] It's not.
[00:54:38.280 --> 00:54:44.920] So, think through what do they need to know, believe, or do at this exact moment to take further action.
[00:54:44.920 --> 00:54:54.840] And then, this is like a very cheap and easy one, but my personal pet peeve is when a contact form has 27 questions and like a blood type and a social security request.
[00:54:54.840 --> 00:54:58.120] I'm like, this person's trying to get in touch with you.
[00:54:58.120 --> 00:54:59.320] Make that easy.
[00:54:59.320 --> 00:55:03.240] Make whatever action you want them to take so easy.
[00:55:03.240 --> 00:55:05.000] Reduce any friction.
[00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:06.520] And so, we've been guilty of this.
[00:55:06.520 --> 00:55:10.040] Our checkout process was like too many things.
[00:55:10.040 --> 00:55:14.120] And people were like, I tried to check out, but then I was having trouble on mobile.
[00:55:14.120 --> 00:55:20.520] And I'm like, this is the worst possible thing for there to be friction at that point where they are ready to take action.
[00:55:20.520 --> 00:55:25.800] So, go through your entire buying journey and be like, okay, what part of this felt hard?
[00:55:25.800 --> 00:55:28.520] Was there anything where I had to like stop and really think?
[00:55:28.520 --> 00:55:31.080] Did I have to go get something that I didn't have?
[00:55:31.080 --> 00:55:33.240] And so, it kept me from taking action.
[00:55:33.240 --> 00:55:35.480] Where can you reduce friction on your site?
[00:55:35.480 --> 00:55:39.720] That unnecessary friction is one of the biggest things that kills conversion.
[00:55:39.720 --> 00:

Prompt 2: Key Takeaways

Now please extract the key takeaways from the transcript content I provided.

Extract the most important key takeaways from this part of the conversation. Use a single sentence statement (the key takeaway) rather than milquetoast descriptions like "the hosts discuss...". 

Limit the key takeaways to a maximum of 3. The key takeaways should be insightful and knowledge-additive. 

IMPORTANT: Return ONLY valid JSON, no explanations or markdown. Ensure:
- All strings are properly quoted and escaped
- No trailing commas
- All braces and brackets are balanced
Format: {"key_takeaways": ["takeaway 1", "takeaway 2"]}

Prompt 3: Segments

Now identify 2-4 distinct topical segments from this part of the conversation.

For each segment, identify:
- Descriptive title (3-6 words)  
- START timestamp when this topic begins (HH:MM:SS format)
- Double check that the timestamp is accurate - a timestamp will NEVER be greater than the total length of the audio
- Most important Key takeaway from that segment. Key takeaway must be specific and knowledge-additive.
- Brief summary of the discussion

IMPORTANT: The timestamp should mark when the topic/segment STARTS, not a range. Look for topic transitions and conversation shifts.

Return ONLY valid JSON. Ensure all strings are properly quoted, no trailing commas:
{
  "segments": [
    {
      "segment_title": "Topic Discussion", 
      "timestamp": "01:15:30",
      "key_takeaway": "main point from this segment",
      "segment_summary": "brief description of what was discussed"
    }
  ]
}

Timestamp format: HH:MM:SS (e.g., 00:05:30, 01:22:45) marking the START of each segment.

Prompt 4: Media Mentions

Now scan the transcript content I provided for ACTUAL mentions of specific media titles:

Find explicit mentions of:
- Books (with specific titles)
- Movies (with specific titles)  
- TV Shows (with specific titles)
- Music/Songs (with specific titles)

DO NOT include:
- Websites, URLs, or web services
- Other podcasts or podcast names

IMPORTANT: 
- Only include items explicitly mentioned by name. Do not invent titles.
- Valid categories are: "Book", "Movie", "TV Show", "Music"
- Include the exact phrase where each item was mentioned
- Find the nearest proximate timestamp where it appears in the conversation
- THE TIMESTAMP OF THE MEDIA MENTION IS IMPORTANT - DO NOT INVENT TIMESTAMPS AND DO NOT MISATTRIBUTE TIMESTAMPS
- Double check that the timestamp is accurate - a timestamp will NEVER be greater than the total length of the audio
- Timestamps are given as ranges, e.g. 01:13:42.520 --> 01:13:46.720. Use the EARLIER of the 2 timestamps in the range.

Return ONLY valid JSON. Ensure all strings are properly quoted and escaped, no trailing commas:
{
  "media_mentions": [
    {
      "title": "Exact Title as Mentioned",
      "category": "Book",
      "author_artist": "N/A",
      "context": "Brief context of why it was mentioned",
      "context_phrase": "The exact sentence or phrase where it was mentioned",
      "timestamp": "estimated time like 01:15:30"
    }
  ]
}

If no media is mentioned, return: {"media_mentions": []}

Prompt 5: Context Setup

You are an expert data extractor tasked with analyzing a podcast transcript. 
I will provide you with part 2 of 2 from a podcast transcript. 
I will then ask you to extract different types of information from this content in subsequent messages. Please confirm you have received and understood the transcript content.

Transcript section:
ou're including.
[00:54:26.400 --> 00:54:28.720] So, it's not just every possible thing.
[00:54:28.720 --> 00:54:33.880] You know, if you were a bride, you don't need to know at the very front of the process how much an album costs.
[00:54:34.440 --> 00:54:37.880] That information is not relevant to that person at that part of their buying journey.
[00:54:37.880 --> 00:54:38.280] It's not.
[00:54:38.280 --> 00:54:44.920] So, think through what do they need to know, believe, or do at this exact moment to take further action.
[00:54:44.920 --> 00:54:54.840] And then, this is like a very cheap and easy one, but my personal pet peeve is when a contact form has 27 questions and like a blood type and a social security request.
[00:54:54.840 --> 00:54:58.120] I'm like, this person's trying to get in touch with you.
[00:54:58.120 --> 00:54:59.320] Make that easy.
[00:54:59.320 --> 00:55:03.240] Make whatever action you want them to take so easy.
[00:55:03.240 --> 00:55:05.000] Reduce any friction.
[00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:06.520] And so, we've been guilty of this.
[00:55:06.520 --> 00:55:10.040] Our checkout process was like too many things.
[00:55:10.040 --> 00:55:14.120] And people were like, I tried to check out, but then I was having trouble on mobile.
[00:55:14.120 --> 00:55:20.520] And I'm like, this is the worst possible thing for there to be friction at that point where they are ready to take action.
[00:55:20.520 --> 00:55:25.800] So, go through your entire buying journey and be like, okay, what part of this felt hard?
[00:55:25.800 --> 00:55:28.520] Was there anything where I had to like stop and really think?
[00:55:28.520 --> 00:55:31.080] Did I have to go get something that I didn't have?
[00:55:31.080 --> 00:55:33.240] And so, it kept me from taking action.
[00:55:33.240 --> 00:55:35.480] Where can you reduce friction on your site?
[00:55:35.480 --> 00:55:39.720] That unnecessary friction is one of the biggest things that kills conversion.
[00:55:39.720 --> 00:55:41.000] And so, that's the biggest thing.
[00:55:41.000 --> 00:55:42.840] Just look for friction anywhere on your site.
[00:55:42.840 --> 00:55:43.640] Where was it difficult?
[00:55:43.640 --> 00:55:45.800] Where could someone not find what they needed?
[00:55:45.800 --> 00:55:48.440] Where did they get stuck because a link was broken?
[00:55:48.440 --> 00:55:57.320] Go through it and evaluate it like a client and then do that audit because that's where you're going to catch all those other things that like don't make sense or that someone's actually going, This doesn't resonate with me yet.
[00:55:57.320 --> 00:55:57.960] Why is this here?
[00:55:57.960 --> 00:55:59.000] I don't believe it.
[00:55:59.000 --> 00:55:59.640] Yes.
[00:55:59.640 --> 00:56:00.600] Oh my gosh.
[00:56:00.600 --> 00:56:01.400] Okay.
[00:56:01.400 --> 00:56:06.360] Tell us where everyone can find out more about you, the templates.
[00:56:06.360 --> 00:56:08.760] We have a special offer for our listeners.
[00:56:08.760 --> 00:56:15.040] Let me remind you: Jen was on episode number two of this very podcast.
[00:56:15.040 --> 00:56:16.800] You are the true OG.
[00:56:16.800 --> 00:56:19.280] That is how long we have been working together.
[00:56:14.600 --> 00:56:21.520] That is how long I have been a fan of hers.
[00:56:21.760 --> 00:56:33.120] And so I have watched so many of my best friends in the business hire you because I am the evangelist of like Jen creates the best templates.
[00:56:33.120 --> 00:56:39.520] I want everybody I know in my life to have one because there's something different about being proud of it.
[00:56:39.520 --> 00:56:41.200] So tell us a little bit more.
[00:56:41.200 --> 00:56:42.480] I'm so proud to tell you.
[00:56:42.480 --> 00:56:48.560] You can go to jennakutcher.com/slash tonic for the special offer that we've worked up and the website on it.
[00:56:48.560 --> 00:56:53.840] And then you can find me on my website that I'm very proud of at tonicsiteshop.com.
[00:56:53.840 --> 00:56:58.480] And if you want to go see our content on social, you can do that at tonic siteshop.
[00:56:58.480 --> 00:57:01.600] And then we're famous for our long and weird marketing newsletter.
[00:57:01.600 --> 00:57:11.760] And if you go to tonicsiteshop.com/slash list, you can get my long and weird emails every Friday that at least 12 people really, really love out of the 40,000.
[00:57:11.760 --> 00:57:13.120] I love them.
[00:57:13.120 --> 00:57:14.960] Jen, thank you so much.
[00:57:14.960 --> 00:57:20.080] I would just say, if anything, go and just browse jennakutcher.com/slash tonic.
[00:57:20.080 --> 00:57:30.480] We highlight our favorite templates and the ones that our audience goes nuts over, but even just study them, look at them, see how they're set up.
[00:57:30.480 --> 00:57:33.040] Like use it to inspire you.
[00:57:33.040 --> 00:57:42.320] Whether you purchase or not, I think there is so much gold to be uncovered inside of the design of my own website of this page.
[00:57:42.320 --> 00:57:44.320] And of course, go get that audit sheet.
[00:57:44.320 --> 00:57:45.360] You cannot find it anywhere else.
[00:57:45.360 --> 00:57:47.360] Jenna Kutcher.com slash tonic.
[00:57:47.360 --> 00:57:50.000] Jen, thank you for coming back on the show.
[00:57:50.000 --> 00:57:52.400] Thank you for being with me since the very beginning.
[00:57:53.200 --> 00:57:59.440] Thank you for giving me a chance to a beautiful home on the internet that I absolutely adore.
[00:57:59.440 --> 00:58:07.320] You have just really transformed the web for so many entrepreneurs, and it's just such a joy to walk alongside of you while you do it.
[00:58:07.320 --> 00:58:08.600] It's so good to be back.
[00:58:08.600 --> 00:58:09.480] Always fun.
[00:58:09.480 --> 00:58:14.680] And just, I'll always remember you in the sweatshirt with the bear drinking a beer, where it all began.
[00:58:14.680 --> 00:58:15.560] So thanks for it.
[00:58:15.720 --> 00:58:16.680] It all began.
[00:58:18.040 --> 00:58:20.040] Oh, thanks, Jen.
[00:58:20.680 --> 00:58:25.720] It's honestly crazy when I think about episode number two of the show.
[00:58:25.720 --> 00:58:31.720] Jen was the first person that I invited to ever come on this podcast years and years and years ago.
[00:58:31.720 --> 00:58:40.920] And she has just been a creative force in my business, but also the person I send people to every single time.
[00:58:40.920 --> 00:58:45.320] My best friends in the industry have now worked with Jen.
[00:58:45.320 --> 00:58:57.320] I sing her praises because she is so strategic and talented and thoughtful, not only when it comes to beautiful design, but also in thinking through the actual strategy of having your website work for you.
[00:58:57.320 --> 00:59:08.680] I hope this conversation leaves you feeling fired up and excited to get your website beautified, to make sure it's strategic, to heck, have a website at all if you don't have one yet.
[00:59:08.680 --> 00:59:14.520] And if a tonic template feels like the next right step for you, go to jennakutcher.com forward slash template.
[00:59:14.520 --> 00:59:16.200] They are absolutely stunning.
[00:59:16.200 --> 00:59:22.520] All of my websites have been based off of the templates and using the templates that Jen has created inside of the site shop.
[00:59:22.520 --> 00:59:23.720] And I am just obsessed.
[00:59:23.720 --> 00:59:26.680] They have changed my life and so many of your lives.
[00:59:26.680 --> 00:59:28.600] And I want to make sure that you have a template you love.
[00:59:28.600 --> 00:59:31.320] So jennakutcher.com forward slash tonic.
[00:59:31.320 --> 00:59:36.600] Jen has a special offer for us, as well as the audit that she shared in today's episode.
[00:59:36.600 --> 00:59:38.840] It's the only place you can find it on the internet.
[00:59:38.840 --> 00:59:44.280] Go get that audit, check out your site, and see what you need to do in order to make your site work for you.
[00:59:44.280 --> 00:59:47.280] That's Jenna Kutcher.com forward slash tonic.
[00:59:44.920 --> 00:59:50.640] Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Gold Digger Podcast.
[00:59:50.800 --> 00:59:57.600] If you know anyone who could benefit from tuning in, be a good friend and send it on over to them.
[00:59:57.600 --> 01:00:01.600] And until next time, Gold Diggers, keep on digging your biggest goals.
[01:00:01.600 --> 01:00:05.360] And thank you so much for listening to this episode of the podcast.
[01:00:06.000 --> 01:00:09.680] Thanks for pulling up a seat for another episode of the Gold Digger Podcast.
[01:00:09.680 --> 01:00:19.120] I hope today's episode filled you with inspiration, gave you information that you can turn into action, and realigned you with your true north in life and business.
[01:00:19.120 --> 01:00:29.680] If you've enjoyed today's episode, head on over to GoldDiggerPodcast.com for today's show notes, discount codes for our sponsors, freebies to fuel your results, and so much more.
[01:00:29.680 --> 01:00:34.240] And if you haven't yet, make sure you're subscribed so that you never miss a future show.
[01:00:34.240 --> 01:00:36.960] We'll see you next time, Gold Diggers.
[01:00:38.560 --> 01:00:50.880] Please note, this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements, and individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in the episode.
[01:00:50.880 --> 01:00:56.960] Your support through affiliate links or sponsored content helps us continue to bring you valuable content.
[01:00:56.960 --> 01:00:59.840] Thank you for being a part of the Goldigger community.

Prompt 6: Key Takeaways

Now please extract the key takeaways from the transcript content I provided.

Extract the most important key takeaways from this part of the conversation. Use a single sentence statement (the key takeaway) rather than milquetoast descriptions like "the hosts discuss...". 

Limit the key takeaways to a maximum of 3. The key takeaways should be insightful and knowledge-additive. 

IMPORTANT: Return ONLY valid JSON, no explanations or markdown. Ensure:
- All strings are properly quoted and escaped
- No trailing commas
- All braces and brackets are balanced
Format: {"key_takeaways": ["takeaway 1", "takeaway 2"]}

Prompt 7: Segments

Now identify 2-4 distinct topical segments from this part of the conversation.

For each segment, identify:
- Descriptive title (3-6 words)  
- START timestamp when this topic begins (HH:MM:SS format)
- Double check that the timestamp is accurate - a timestamp will NEVER be greater than the total length of the audio
- Most important Key takeaway from that segment. Key takeaway must be specific and knowledge-additive.
- Brief summary of the discussion

IMPORTANT: The timestamp should mark when the topic/segment STARTS, not a range. Look for topic transitions and conversation shifts.

Return ONLY valid JSON. Ensure all strings are properly quoted, no trailing commas:
{
  "segments": [
    {
      "segment_title": "Topic Discussion", 
      "timestamp": "01:15:30",
      "key_takeaway": "main point from this segment",
      "segment_summary": "brief description of what was discussed"
    }
  ]
}

Timestamp format: HH:MM:SS (e.g., 00:05:30, 01:22:45) marking the START of each segment.

Prompt 8: Media Mentions

Now scan the transcript content I provided for ACTUAL mentions of specific media titles:

Find explicit mentions of:
- Books (with specific titles)
- Movies (with specific titles)  
- TV Shows (with specific titles)
- Music/Songs (with specific titles)

DO NOT include:
- Websites, URLs, or web services
- Other podcasts or podcast names

IMPORTANT: 
- Only include items explicitly mentioned by name. Do not invent titles.
- Valid categories are: "Book", "Movie", "TV Show", "Music"
- Include the exact phrase where each item was mentioned
- Find the nearest proximate timestamp where it appears in the conversation
- THE TIMESTAMP OF THE MEDIA MENTION IS IMPORTANT - DO NOT INVENT TIMESTAMPS AND DO NOT MISATTRIBUTE TIMESTAMPS
- Double check that the timestamp is accurate - a timestamp will NEVER be greater than the total length of the audio
- Timestamps are given as ranges, e.g. 01:13:42.520 --> 01:13:46.720. Use the EARLIER of the 2 timestamps in the range.

Return ONLY valid JSON. Ensure all strings are properly quoted and escaped, no trailing commas:
{
  "media_mentions": [
    {
      "title": "Exact Title as Mentioned",
      "category": "Book",
      "author_artist": "N/A",
      "context": "Brief context of why it was mentioned",
      "context_phrase": "The exact sentence or phrase where it was mentioned",
      "timestamp": "estimated time like 01:15:30"
    }
  ]
}

If no media is mentioned, return: {"media_mentions": []}

Full Transcript

[00:00:01.440 --> 00:00:05.440] Ever whispered, maybe I could create an online course someday?
[00:00:05.440 --> 00:00:10.240] And then you thought, nope, too overwhelming, too risky, and way too much tech.
[00:00:10.240 --> 00:00:11.840] That's you, I get it.
[00:00:11.840 --> 00:00:18.160] When I started, I had no clue where to begin, no extra hours, and no idea if anyone would buy.
[00:00:18.160 --> 00:00:20.400] Then I met Amy Porterfield.
[00:00:20.400 --> 00:00:27.120] She gave me a clear, doable path, and that someday dream became a profitable, sustainable part of my business.
[00:00:27.120 --> 00:00:31.600] Now I've built multiple online courses that earn while I live my life.
[00:00:31.600 --> 00:00:37.680] That's why I'm so excited to tell you about Course Confident, a live boot camp with Amy herself.
[00:00:37.680 --> 00:00:40.560] Four live trainings with one clear outcome.
[00:00:40.560 --> 00:00:49.360] Nail your profitable course topic, choose your type and price with confidence, and learn how to attract your future students without being glued to your screen.
[00:00:49.360 --> 00:00:52.240] You'll be in a private-driven community that gets it.
[00:00:52.240 --> 00:01:02.000] The doubts, the wins, the why is this so hard moments, the accountability, ideas, and encouragement you need to move from thinking about it to doing it.
[00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:05.360] Join through jennakutcher.com forward slash bootcamp.
[00:01:05.360 --> 00:01:15.120] And when you join, you'll also get my beginner-friendly mini course, The Pinterest Kickstart, which is your quick start guide to growing your audience and email list before you even launch.
[00:01:15.120 --> 00:01:17.920] $27 of value, yours free.
[00:01:17.920 --> 00:01:24.960] If you want more freedom, more alignment, and income you don't have to chase daily, this is your next right step.
[00:01:24.960 --> 00:01:26.720] We start September 11th.
[00:01:26.720 --> 00:01:31.600] Save your spot today at jennakutcher.com forward slash bootcamp.
[00:01:35.440 --> 00:01:38.960] Huge savings on Dell AI PCs are here.
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[00:02:30.600 --> 00:02:33.720] That's dell.com/slash deals.
[00:02:38.520 --> 00:02:40.680] Your website isn't a nice to have.
[00:02:40.680 --> 00:02:43.240] It's one of your most powerful business tools.
[00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:53.400] In this conversation with Jen Olmsted, we reveal how to turn your website into an investment that pays you back, attracting the right people, making you money, and finally feeling like you.
[00:02:54.360 --> 00:02:57.960] I'm Jenna Kutcher, your host of the Goldigger podcast.
[00:02:57.960 --> 00:03:04.760] I escaped the corporate world at the age of 23 with nothing more than a $300 camera from Craigslist and a dream.
[00:03:04.760 --> 00:03:12.920] Now I'm running a seven-figure online business that feels even better than it looks all from my house in small town, Minnesota with my family.
[00:03:12.920 --> 00:03:15.880] Here, we value time as our currency.
[00:03:15.880 --> 00:03:23.240] We mix the woo and the work, and we are in the pursuit of building businesses that give us the freedom to live lives that we love.
[00:03:23.240 --> 00:03:28.520] I've always loved turning big goals into reality, and I'm here to help you do the same.
[00:03:28.520 --> 00:03:30.760] This isn't just a peek behind the curtain.
[00:03:30.760 --> 00:03:34.440] Come along with me and my guests as we tear the whole curtain down.
[00:03:34.440 --> 00:03:41.880] Every week, we tackle practical, no-fluff marketing strategies and host honest discussions on what works and what doesn't.
[00:03:41.880 --> 00:03:47.840] Join me and my expert guests for actionable insights to help you grow your dream business with confidence.
[00:03:44.840 --> 00:03:52.000] Pull up a seat and get ready to be challenged, inspired, and empowered.
[00:03:52.320 --> 00:03:55.280] This is the Gold Digger podcast.
[00:03:56.240 --> 00:03:59.600] Have you ever whispered to yourself, I really need a website?
[00:03:59.600 --> 00:04:03.200] And then you immediately close a tab and told yourself you're not ready yet.
[00:04:03.200 --> 00:04:06.640] Or maybe you have a website, but it's kind of a mess.
[00:04:06.640 --> 00:04:08.160] You're embarrassed to send people there.
[00:04:08.160 --> 00:04:09.920] It doesn't reflect your business anymore.
[00:04:09.920 --> 00:04:13.120] And honestly, you don't even know if it's doing anything.
[00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:28.880] In a world of endless funnels, pop-ups, email sequences, and social media strategies, it is easy to forget that your website, a beautiful, simple, strategic home on the internet, can still be your most powerful business tool if it's done right.
[00:04:28.880 --> 00:04:32.240] And that's what today's guest is here to unpack.
[00:04:32.240 --> 00:04:43.840] Jen Omsted is a brand and web designer, a visual storyteller, and a certified type nerd who has made it her mission to create online spaces that people actually want to explore.
[00:04:43.840 --> 00:04:52.240] She's also the co-founder of Tonic Sight Shop, home of the most stunning cocktail-inspired website templates for modern stylish creatives.
[00:04:52.240 --> 00:04:57.360] She's also a very, very dear friend of mine and no stranger to the Gold Digger podcast.
[00:04:57.360 --> 00:05:03.760] Jen was actually the very first guest ever on this show way back in episode number two.
[00:05:03.760 --> 00:05:09.200] And she came back again in 2020 to share some questions you should ask before designing your website.
[00:05:09.200 --> 00:05:24.880] Now, what I love about Jen's work is how it combines aesthetics and strategy in a way that helps you build a website that actually works for you, meaning it's attracting the right people and telling your story clearly and converting visitors into paying clients or customers.
[00:05:24.880 --> 00:05:34.600] That can be done while you are living your life and stepping away from your screen and finally stopping to feel like you have to be on all the time.
[00:05:34.760 --> 00:05:37.800] Your website can be working while you rest.
[00:05:37.800 --> 00:05:46.360] So, whether you have been duct taping your site together or you don't even have a website at all yet, trust me, this episode is for you.
[00:05:46.360 --> 00:05:57.560] And if you are ready to give your website a major glow up after this conversation, you can chop tonic templates at jennakutcher.com forward slash tonic and use the code Jenna sent me.
[00:05:57.560 --> 00:05:59.640] It's Jenna sent me all one word.
[00:05:59.640 --> 00:06:05.240] Head to jennakutcher.com forward slash tonic because you deserve a website that works while you rest.
[00:06:05.240 --> 00:06:11.560] And let me tell you, this episode is going to leave you so fired up and so excited to work on your site.
[00:06:11.560 --> 00:06:13.080] All right, let's get into it.
[00:06:13.080 --> 00:06:17.160] Jen Ohm said, Welcome back to the Gold Digger podcast.
[00:06:17.480 --> 00:06:20.600] Okay, here's a big question that I want to start off with.
[00:06:20.600 --> 00:06:30.360] So here's my question: What if the reason your business feels stuck isn't because you're doing too little, but because your website isn't doing enough?
[00:06:30.680 --> 00:06:33.400] Yeah, it's a tale as old as time.
[00:06:33.400 --> 00:06:46.680] And the mental picture that always comes to me is like seeing this girl in a cute matching Lulu workout set on the treadmill at the gym, and she's just like sweating, working so hard, but the treadmill is not actually plugged in.
[00:06:47.000 --> 00:07:01.160] And it's, I think it's like that when your website isn't really working for you because you are like hustling, you're posting on Instagram, networking, sending emails, doing all the things, but you're still not moving forward because the place you're sending the traffic isn't actually converting for you.
[00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:13.240] And so it's one of those things where, like, you can be working so hard doing so many things right, but if your website isn't working, it's like you have this star salesman that is sitting under the desk eating snacks and like doom strolling.
[00:07:13.240 --> 00:07:21.360] And I just feel like most people don't realize that your website should be this part of your business that works harder than you do.
[00:07:21.680 --> 00:07:22.640] It could be great.
[00:07:22.640 --> 00:07:24.000] Like it doesn't get tired.
[00:07:24.000 --> 00:07:25.200] It doesn't need a break.
[00:07:25.200 --> 00:07:27.200] It doesn't need to like scroll Netflix.
[00:07:27.200 --> 00:07:29.840] It can be out there fielding every lead.
[00:07:29.840 --> 00:07:33.120] It can be convincing people that you're the best option.
[00:07:33.120 --> 00:07:39.840] And so a lot of times I think we don't think we're working hard enough, but really it's just our website that's not doing its job.
[00:07:39.840 --> 00:07:45.840] It's like this beautiful storefront, but there's like a coming soon sign or the front door is locked.
[00:07:45.840 --> 00:07:55.120] And so I think if you're like feeling stuck in your business, it's really worth asking, like, is it me or is my website just quietly sabotaging all of my hard work?
[00:07:55.120 --> 00:08:04.080] Because when you fix that, all the effort that you're putting in on the treadmill suddenly results in this forward momentum and an actual sales for your business.
[00:08:04.800 --> 00:08:05.120] Okay.
[00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:20.880] I am obsessed and I'm obsessed with that metaphor because I think you just hit the nail on the head for so many people listening where they're like, I am literally doing all the things and it is not resulting in results.
[00:08:20.880 --> 00:08:28.880] And that feeling is probably the most empty, lonely, frustrating feeling of entrepreneurship.
[00:08:28.880 --> 00:08:34.400] And I feel like our tendencies are to turn towards the really shiny things like social media.
[00:08:34.400 --> 00:08:38.080] Like, if only I go viral, then this will solve the problem.
[00:08:38.080 --> 00:08:39.760] And I don't know about you, but I've gone viral.
[00:08:39.760 --> 00:08:42.480] It did nothing for my business.
[00:08:42.480 --> 00:08:48.320] And so I love this idea of like our website should be working for us and not the other way around.
[00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:49.920] So, here's my question.
[00:08:49.920 --> 00:09:07.400] So, most entrepreneurs, and you and I have like witnessed this in the flesh, they're either embarrassed about their website, they feel behind when it comes to their website, or it's like one of those lingering things on there to do of like, I should probably get one or I should probably like update it.
[00:09:07.720 --> 00:09:10.120] So, what would you say to the person who's listening?
[00:09:10.120 --> 00:09:15.560] And they're already overwhelmed by just thinking about a website because they don't even know where to start.
[00:09:15.560 --> 00:09:18.120] Well, first of all, I would just say, I get it.
[00:09:18.120 --> 00:09:19.640] It feels overwhelming.
[00:09:19.640 --> 00:09:22.440] And we just said, like, your website can be your star salesman.
[00:09:22.440 --> 00:09:23.480] Like, it could be so great.
[00:09:23.480 --> 00:09:26.200] And you're like, cool, but like, how do I get that?
[00:09:26.200 --> 00:09:26.760] Right.
[00:09:26.760 --> 00:09:33.400] And I think the biggest thing that I would tell people is, like, you do not have to build Roam from scratch.
[00:09:33.400 --> 00:09:39.400] You do not need to all of a sudden figure out how to reinvent the website wheel because you don't have time for that.
[00:09:39.400 --> 00:09:42.520] Like, you're trying to get 50 grams of protein a day, like, you know, a meal.
[00:09:42.520 --> 00:09:46.600] Like, this, we, we do not have time to figure out how to design websites from scratch.
[00:09:46.600 --> 00:09:50.040] And so, that's where I feel like I would say start with a template.
[00:09:50.040 --> 00:09:55.640] Like, you do not need to pay a professional $50,000 or figure it out yourself.
[00:09:55.640 --> 00:09:58.920] That is like not the binary decision that we have to make.
[00:09:58.920 --> 00:10:00.680] It's 2025.
[00:10:00.680 --> 00:10:02.280] There's a template for that.
[00:10:02.280 --> 00:10:09.880] And so, now with the advent of things like Canva, we recognize how much time we can save by not starting from scratch.
[00:10:09.880 --> 00:10:18.200] With AI, like when you don't have a blank page in front of you, or even a custom designer that's like, yeah, I can do that in a year and a half.
[00:10:18.200 --> 00:10:23.160] When you have a template that you can plug and play into, it's so beneficial.
[00:10:23.160 --> 00:10:32.520] And I was thinking about this the other day because my husband, Aaron, and I just launched an Airbnb locally, and I'm a designer, a web designer, not an interior designer.
[00:10:32.520 --> 00:10:36.600] And I am like trying to cobble everything together literally from scratch.
[00:10:36.600 --> 00:10:51.360] And I told my husband, I'm like, man, if there was like a Scandinavian living room template that I could just like hit add to card on, I would throw my credit card at that company so quickly because I hated starting from scratch.
[00:10:44.680 --> 00:10:54.800] I ordered five different rugs because they didn't fit.
[00:10:54.800 --> 00:10:55.920] And I am a designer.
[00:10:55.920 --> 00:10:56.880] This is what I do.
[00:10:56.880 --> 00:11:06.640] So I think when you start with a template, it's kind of like you're moving into this gorgeous, fully furnished home where someone's made all of the big decisions for you.
[00:11:06.640 --> 00:11:12.960] You know, the couch is going to fit and it's going to match the coffee table, and these curtains are going to be the right length.
[00:11:12.960 --> 00:11:14.720] They have made the big decisions.
[00:11:14.720 --> 00:11:20.720] So you can just hang some art and stock the fridge and personalize it to you and go.
[00:11:20.720 --> 00:11:36.240] And I think that peace of mind of like knowing someone strategically thought through all of these decisions is such a game changer because then you can just do the fun part and say, okay, putting in my work, putting in some copy that sounds like a human, the hard part was done for you.
[00:11:36.240 --> 00:11:39.040] And so I think that that is just a huge thing I would say.
[00:11:39.040 --> 00:11:42.000] If you're feeling overwhelmed, don't start from scratch.
[00:11:42.000 --> 00:11:46.400] Like start from something that someone has already considered all of the hard stuff.
[00:11:46.400 --> 00:11:47.440] Oh my gosh.
[00:11:47.440 --> 00:11:50.640] I couldn't agree more in so many ways.
[00:11:50.640 --> 00:11:56.720] And I'm laughing because I am thinking back to the days where I tried to be like an HTML coder.
[00:11:56.720 --> 00:12:04.880] Like I tried to take my MySpace knowledge of making a cool sidebar onto WordPress.
[00:12:04.880 --> 00:12:17.440] And I then ended up in like website jail having a developer overseas where I just needed to change the year on my wedding website of like pricing for whatever year it was.
[00:12:17.440 --> 00:12:21.200] And it would take two weeks and cost like $200.
[00:12:21.200 --> 00:12:25.040] And it's just fascinating because I feel like there are two camps.
[00:12:25.040 --> 00:12:40.360] People do feel like it's this binary thing where it's like, either I'm going to be scrappy and I'm going to figure this all out by myself and I'm going to DIY it, but it's going to take me like two years to get it done, or I need to go fully custom and it's going to take months and months and months of time.
[00:12:40.360 --> 00:12:48.520] It's funny, Jen, how many people who have beautifully established businesses will reach out to me and they'll be like, I need to work with Jen.
[00:12:48.520 --> 00:12:55.640] And I'm like, you can work with her and you can buy one of her templates because it is going to save you so much time.
[00:12:55.640 --> 00:12:58.280] It is going to save Jen so much time.
[00:12:58.280 --> 00:13:01.080] She puts the best stuff into these things.
[00:13:01.080 --> 00:13:05.000] And so the treatment that I got is based off of her templates.
[00:13:05.000 --> 00:13:08.360] Like you're literally looking at her work in that way.
[00:13:08.360 --> 00:13:08.920] Exactly.
[00:13:08.920 --> 00:13:10.920] And I think like we've had customers reach out.
[00:13:10.920 --> 00:13:14.280] This lady, Emily, reached out to me and she's like, hey, Jen, it was like 7 p.m.
[00:13:14.360 --> 00:13:17.000] And she's like, Jen, like, I'm desperate to work with you.
[00:13:17.000 --> 00:13:18.280] I saw Jenna's website.
[00:13:18.280 --> 00:13:19.560] Like, this is what I need.
[00:13:19.560 --> 00:13:21.000] Like, I just need your genius.
[00:13:21.000 --> 00:13:23.000] I need you to like take a look at this.
[00:13:23.000 --> 00:13:24.440] And I was like, I was reading this email.
[00:13:24.440 --> 00:13:25.000] It's like 7 p.m.
[00:13:25.080 --> 00:13:25.640] I'm not going to respond.
[00:13:25.640 --> 00:13:27.080] I'm like, I'll respond to her in the morning.
[00:13:27.080 --> 00:13:34.440] And I got this email from her the next morning that she was like, after I emailed you, I went to Tonic and started looking at your templates.
[00:13:34.440 --> 00:13:37.080] I realized this one was actually really perfect for me.
[00:13:37.080 --> 00:13:40.440] I customized it and I just hit launch this morning.
[00:13:41.640 --> 00:13:51.480] And like literally for a savings off, you know, she had just paid a developer $75,000 to design a website and then was like in website jail.
[00:13:51.480 --> 00:13:59.880] Like you said, it had this distinct, you know, so many people suffering from website shame out there who are like, Jen, please don't go to my website.
[00:13:59.880 --> 00:14:03.480] And I'm like, oh no, like we do not, we need to break you out of this jail.
[00:14:03.480 --> 00:14:05.240] It can be easier than you think.
[00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:10.840] And yeah, you may not need very few people truly need like a full custom designer.
[00:14:10.840 --> 00:14:18.240] Often you can start with the bones of something, make it yours, and end up with something that you have and are proud of so much faster.
[00:14:18.400 --> 00:14:20.800] So you can get back to doing your job, right?
[00:14:20.800 --> 00:14:25.840] And that's that's the benefit of you no longer have to apologize for your website.
[00:14:25.840 --> 00:14:28.240] And I think that's something that is so powerful.
[00:14:28.240 --> 00:14:32.320] We always say you need a website that can move as fast as you do.
[00:14:32.800 --> 00:14:43.600] And that I think is such a powerful thing because you can show up confidently, you can send up traffic there, you can launch new offers because you have a website that's supporting everything that you do.
[00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:44.240] Oh my gosh.
[00:14:44.240 --> 00:14:44.480] Okay.
[00:14:44.480 --> 00:14:48.800] So the other day, one of my friends sent me a text message of like, hey, what are you working on?
[00:14:48.800 --> 00:14:50.000] And I was like, oh, okay.
[00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:53.680] So I got this idea and I'm building out the sales page and da da da da.
[00:14:53.920 --> 00:14:57.600] And she's like, hold the phone called a sales page.
[00:14:57.600 --> 00:14:58.880] And I was like, yeah.
[00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:04.960] I was like, I have built out literally hundreds of pages on my website.
[00:15:04.960 --> 00:15:05.680] Hundreds.
[00:15:05.680 --> 00:15:08.800] I'm talking about landing pages, thank you pages, confirmation pages.
[00:15:08.800 --> 00:15:12.480] Like, and she was like, wait, you know how to do that?
[00:15:12.480 --> 00:15:16.240] And I was like, yes, I do that every day.
[00:15:16.240 --> 00:15:21.120] Just this weekend, I posted something on Instagram and it was sending it to a page on my website.
[00:15:21.120 --> 00:15:22.640] And I realized a link was broken.
[00:15:22.640 --> 00:15:28.800] And I quickly popped in to my website, changed that link, and updated it within 10 seconds.
[00:15:28.800 --> 00:15:38.320] And it's like, it's fascinating to me how many people cannot access their own sites, cannot tweak them, cannot change them, cannot build them.
[00:15:38.320 --> 00:15:44.800] And it was just, it was eye-opening to me because again, it's like, we're so close to this that I'm like, of course you can do this.
[00:15:44.800 --> 00:15:47.040] This is literally what we do.
[00:15:47.360 --> 00:15:59.440] And it's wild to me because if you do not have control of your website and if you do not feel confident inside of your website, I would argue that you don't even really own your website, right?
[00:15:59.440 --> 00:15:59.880] Absolutely.
[00:15:59.840 --> 00:16:03.080] Your website owns you and your website owns your results.
[00:16:03.400 --> 00:16:13.640] And so the fact that in the year we are in, people still don't feel like they have options and control, it is crazy to me.
[00:16:13.640 --> 00:16:15.400] There is a much better way.
[00:16:15.400 --> 00:16:22.040] So one of the things that you say that I love is that like your website can and should do the heavy lifting for you.
[00:16:22.040 --> 00:16:25.480] And I have seen that time and time again in my own business.
[00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:27.080] What does that actually look like?
[00:16:27.080 --> 00:16:32.360] And like what would somebody need to have in place in order for that to be true?
[00:16:32.360 --> 00:16:39.480] Yeah, I mean, I just think like your website should be hyping your brand when you are at home like ignoring text in your sweatpants.
[00:16:39.480 --> 00:16:43.160] Like your website is always on, so you don't have to be.
[00:16:43.160 --> 00:16:47.560] And so I think that's where the heavy lifting conversion is done on your website.
[00:16:47.880 --> 00:16:51.480] That's where people go when they need to make a buying decision.
[00:16:51.480 --> 00:17:02.440] So all of your efforts on social media, on email, and on these things become really about how do I get people from this place to my website knowing that it's going to convert.
[00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:07.880] And that is an incredibly powerful thing because then are you having to sell everyone on Instagram?
[00:17:07.880 --> 00:17:08.360] No.
[00:17:08.600 --> 00:17:22.600] Then you just get to show up and engage and create content you actually like and say, okay, I know people are going to like this enough that they're going to go to my website or they're going to go download this freebie and then they're going to read about it and they're going to go to my website to learn more.
[00:17:22.600 --> 00:17:25.000] And that's when your website does the heavy lifting.
[00:17:25.000 --> 00:17:28.360] It is the end result that you're sending people every time.
[00:17:28.360 --> 00:17:33.240] And I think what most people don't realize is that that's already happening for better or for worse.
[00:17:33.240 --> 00:17:33.640] Yes.
[00:17:33.640 --> 00:17:39.960] When someone sees your content or they go, like, ooh, I love this photographer, or wow, this coach looks amazing.
[00:17:39.960 --> 00:17:41.320] Where do they go?
[00:17:41.320 --> 00:17:42.520] They go to your website.
[00:17:42.520 --> 00:17:45.000] They go, okay, is this as good as I think it is?
[00:17:45.040 --> 00:17:51.520] And it's kind of like when you see a restaurant on social media or when you look at a storefront, you're like, well, I'm going to go inside.
[00:17:51.520 --> 00:17:54.480] Like, I can't buy anything from the street, you know?
[00:17:54.480 --> 00:17:58.560] And so they're going to go inside and that's where they validate your offer.
[00:17:58.560 --> 00:18:02.000] That's where they go, are you the person I think you are?
[00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:05.040] Or I have 47 tabs open.
[00:18:05.040 --> 00:18:06.400] Which person am I going to pick?
[00:18:06.400 --> 00:18:10.480] I'm going to pick the person that I resonate with the most on their website.
[00:18:10.480 --> 00:18:24.000] And so your website has to do the heavy lifting, but more than that, it means that when you have a website set in place that can do it, you can have the peace of mind of knowing your only job then becomes get people to the website.
[00:18:24.000 --> 00:18:29.120] And so everything changed for us on Instagram, on email, and all of these places.
[00:18:29.120 --> 00:18:38.800] When I stopped trying to sell our website templates on social media and sell them in my emails and sell them in all these places where it was like, go take a look at this.
[00:18:38.800 --> 00:18:40.320] Or like, here, you like us?
[00:18:40.320 --> 00:18:43.760] Like, you're going to go to our website and we know that you're going to convert.
[00:18:43.760 --> 00:18:52.080] And so that's something that I think is such an underutilized tool in most people's business because they simply don't know that that's even possible.
[00:18:52.080 --> 00:18:56.880] And so I think you asked, like, what are the biggest things that you need for that to happen?
[00:18:56.880 --> 00:19:03.840] And I think really there are just three primary things that you need for your website to be this place where it can convert no matter what.
[00:19:03.840 --> 00:19:06.080] And the first one is just clarity.
[00:19:06.400 --> 00:19:16.160] And this is the biggest one people miss because I can't tell you how many website audits I do where I land on someone's beautiful website and it says like, tale as old as time.
[00:19:16.880 --> 00:19:18.640] What does that mean?
[00:19:19.280 --> 00:19:21.520] And I'm like, oh, they're a baker.
[00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:23.760] Like, wow, never saw that coming.
[00:19:23.760 --> 00:19:26.800] You know, so immediate clarity, right?
[00:19:26.800 --> 00:19:30.120] Like, I'm talking, think like a caveman.
[00:19:29.840 --> 00:19:31.640] And we've been guilty of this before.
[00:19:31.960 --> 00:19:37.720] We called our templates customizable websites for so long because we didn't like the word template.
[00:19:37.720 --> 00:19:40.120] And people were like, so are these templates?
[00:19:40.120 --> 00:19:41.560] And we're like, oh, yes.
[00:19:42.520 --> 00:19:44.680] Like, think like a cavemance.
[00:19:44.760 --> 00:19:46.120] Make it super simple.
[00:19:46.120 --> 00:19:49.160] And so my hat for this, I call it an eyebrow.
[00:19:49.160 --> 00:19:55.000] And so you can have a beautiful tagline that says, like, timeless moments captured forever.
[00:19:55.000 --> 00:20:01.400] And in smaller texts, right above that headline, it should say San Antonio wedding photographer.
[00:20:01.720 --> 00:20:04.200] So people go, Okay, I know exactly what this is.
[00:20:04.200 --> 00:20:06.280] So that first one is clarity.
[00:20:06.280 --> 00:20:08.680] That is something you can go to your website right now.
[00:20:08.680 --> 00:20:16.040] I want you to look at it as if you were a caveman or someone's grandmother or a seven-year-old and be like, What do I do?
[00:20:16.040 --> 00:20:17.320] What is this that I offer?
[00:20:17.320 --> 00:20:18.280] So that's number one.
[00:20:18.280 --> 00:20:21.080] The second one is just a clear path.
[00:20:21.080 --> 00:20:28.920] And I want to talk about this a little bit more in a second, but you need to guide them like a GPS to your offer.
[00:20:28.920 --> 00:20:34.920] You need to have a specific path that people are taking to get to what you do.
[00:20:34.920 --> 00:20:36.840] And it needs to be clear and intentional.
[00:20:36.840 --> 00:20:41.880] This is not like a museum tour where they are going through the Louvre with no plan in mind.
[00:20:41.880 --> 00:20:46.920] This is like, how do we get them to take this specific action on your website?
[00:20:46.920 --> 00:20:54.840] Maybe it's a book now button, maybe it's your services, but take them to that place and make all roads lead to Rome, right?
[00:20:54.840 --> 00:20:57.160] That you have not built from scratch.
[00:20:57.160 --> 00:20:58.920] And then the last one, so we have clarity.
[00:20:58.920 --> 00:20:59.960] We have a clear path.
[00:20:59.960 --> 00:21:02.680] And then the last one is just proof.
[00:21:02.680 --> 00:21:09.880] And I think this is the big one because in 2025, really what's changed in the past year is that the buyer's journey used to look like this.
[00:21:10.040 --> 00:21:13.640] It was like, see something you want, buy the thing you want.
[00:21:13.640 --> 00:21:17.280] You know, that was like a simpler time back in like the mid-2000s.
[00:21:17.280 --> 00:21:18.640] Back in the day.
[00:21:18.960 --> 00:21:20.320] It used to be so easy.
[00:21:14.840 --> 00:21:21.040] And you know this too.
[00:21:21.200 --> 00:21:23.280] Like we've talked about this privately.
[00:21:23.280 --> 00:21:25.360] The buyer's journey has just stretched.
[00:21:25.360 --> 00:21:30.080] And I think it looks like this now because people have been to therapy.
[00:21:30.080 --> 00:21:31.520] They have boundaries.
[00:21:31.520 --> 00:21:36.320] They have been burned before by brands who overpromised and didn't deliver.
[00:21:36.320 --> 00:21:43.680] And so now you need to prove what you say that you are doing is what you are going to be delivering to this person.
[00:21:43.680 --> 00:21:46.160] That you can do that for them.
[00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:49.360] You have done it for people like them and you are going to do it again.
[00:21:49.360 --> 00:21:56.800] And so you need to have social proof, testimonials, reviews threaded through every buying decision part of your website.
[00:21:56.800 --> 00:22:05.760] And so on your homepage, case studies on the portfolio, back it up, back it up, back it up, back it up, because people need proof.
[00:22:05.760 --> 00:22:13.520] And so if you want to just instantly dramatically increase your site conversions right now, go ask for reviews.
[00:22:13.520 --> 00:22:18.160] If you need some help with that, we can put our favorite review questions in the show notes.
[00:22:18.160 --> 00:22:24.000] You need to know exactly what people say that you can deliver and you need to thread that through your entire website.
[00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:26.000] So those are the three big things.
[00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:30.080] A clear path through your website and then proof that you can deliver on what you're saying.
[00:22:30.080 --> 00:22:33.200] Those are the biggest things that you need to convert your site.
[00:22:33.200 --> 00:22:34.320] Oh, okay.
[00:22:34.320 --> 00:22:35.920] I love this.
[00:22:35.920 --> 00:22:39.440] There's that quote that's like, clear is better than clever.
[00:22:39.440 --> 00:22:46.880] And I think for so long, people were trying to be like cheeky and clever and clarity is queen right now, right?
[00:22:46.880 --> 00:22:48.560] Like that is one thing.
[00:22:48.880 --> 00:23:03.000] And the other thing, too, that I want to back up about what you're saying that I think is so true and something we consistently think about in our business is for a long time, brands and like the people behind the brands were the hero of the story, right?
[00:23:03.320 --> 00:23:09.560] And now it is like, how do you make the person scrolling the hero of the story and you are the guide, right?
[00:23:09.560 --> 00:23:11.240] That's a way different positioning.
[00:23:11.240 --> 00:23:13.960] Donald Miller teaches this in Story Brand.
[00:23:13.960 --> 00:23:14.520] It's beautiful.
[00:23:14.520 --> 00:23:18.440] It's like you are not the hero of their story, you are the guide.
[00:23:18.440 --> 00:23:29.720] And if you want to position yourself in a way that helps people trust that what you say is true, you need to show them how they are the hero of their own journey and you are simply the guide.
[00:23:29.720 --> 00:23:31.800] And I think that shifts a lot of language.
[00:23:31.800 --> 00:23:33.240] I think that shifts a lot of marketing.
[00:23:33.240 --> 00:23:40.360] And I also think, to your point, that shifts like the need to show that you have guided other people successfully and not just yourself.
[00:23:40.360 --> 00:23:41.880] It's just incredible.
[00:23:41.880 --> 00:23:43.560] And I think that what you're saying is so true.
[00:23:43.560 --> 00:23:55.240] And one of the things that I love to ask people is: what is it about you and your story and your unique talents that makes you uniquely equipped to get your people what they want?
[00:23:55.240 --> 00:23:58.200] That is what your website needs to convey, right?
[00:23:58.520 --> 00:24:01.480] For me, it's like I'm a trained journalist.
[00:24:01.480 --> 00:24:03.240] I love to tell a great story.
[00:24:03.240 --> 00:24:05.960] My medium happens to be design, right?
[00:24:05.960 --> 00:24:09.640] Like I love the words, the visual narrative of a brand.
[00:24:09.640 --> 00:24:12.120] And so that makes me a unique designer.
[00:24:12.120 --> 00:24:18.040] It's also something that's threaded through everything that I do because I believe a website is really a great story told visually.
[00:24:18.040 --> 00:24:19.880] And so that's in all of the templates.
[00:24:19.880 --> 00:24:21.800] They have a story-driven format.
[00:24:21.800 --> 00:24:25.800] And we now know that like stories people remember six times more than facts.
[00:24:25.800 --> 00:24:29.080] And so all of these things, that's what makes me a unique designer.
[00:24:29.080 --> 00:24:30.200] That's what we offer.
[00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:31.240] That's what I sell.
[00:24:31.240 --> 00:24:34.280] And so that allows me to tell that part of my story.
[00:24:34.280 --> 00:24:37.400] That becomes like reasonable and interesting and part of my story.
[00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:38.760] I'm not just telling something.
[00:24:38.760 --> 00:24:46.000] I'm saying, no, no, no, this isn't really about me because this is what allows me to get you what you want, which is a website that tells your story well.
[00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:54.320] So if you're stuck on like what makes you different, think what about me it makes me uniquely equipped to get my people what they want.
[00:24:54.320 --> 00:24:57.120] And if you don't know, the best thing is just to ask.
[00:24:57.120 --> 00:25:03.440] Ask a couple of your friends, ask a couple of your clients, hey, was there anything that you felt like was unique about my approach?
[00:25:03.440 --> 00:25:05.120] What did you love about working with me?
[00:25:05.120 --> 00:25:10.000] You're going to start to hear these word bubbles form of the same things over and over.
[00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:14.880] And that's what I think is so special about brand positioning because then you know, put that on your website, baby.
[00:25:14.880 --> 00:25:16.160] Like, let's go.
[00:25:16.160 --> 00:25:16.640] Yes.
[00:25:16.640 --> 00:25:17.440] Oh my gosh.
[00:25:17.440 --> 00:25:18.480] I love that.
[00:25:18.800 --> 00:25:24.240] I want to pause here for just a sec and thank our sponsors who help bring conversations like this one to life.
[00:25:24.240 --> 00:25:28.480] If you've been nodding along thinking, wait, maybe my site is doing me dirty.
[00:25:28.480 --> 00:25:30.000] Well, you're not alone.
[00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:38.000] After this break, we're diving into what most people get totally wrong about their websites and how to finally make yours a tool that works for you.
[00:25:39.280 --> 00:25:47.280] Running a business means wearing every hat, creating content one minute, handling customer service the next, then trying to figure out shipping logistics.
[00:25:47.520 --> 00:25:49.440] It can get overwhelming fast.
[00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:55.600] When you're building your dreams, finding the right tool that not only helps but simplifies everything is a game changer.
[00:25:55.600 --> 00:25:59.280] For millions of businesses, that tool is Shopify.
[00:25:59.920 --> 00:26:08.720] Shopify powers millions of businesses worldwide and 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S., from Gymshark and Mattel to brands just starting out.
[00:26:08.720 --> 00:26:13.040] With hundreds of ready-to-use templates, you can create a store that matches your brand.
[00:26:13.040 --> 00:26:18.800] Shopify's AI tools write product descriptions and even headlines so you can create content faster.
[00:26:18.800 --> 00:26:23.680] Plus, with their built-in email and social tools, it's like having a marketing team in your back pocket.
[00:26:23.680 --> 00:26:29.120] From inventory to shipping to returns, Shopify is the partner every entrepreneur needs.
[00:26:29.120 --> 00:26:32.040] If you're ready to sell, you're ready for Shopify.
[00:26:32.040 --> 00:26:37.320] Turn your business idea into with Shopify on your side.
[00:26:37.320 --> 00:26:43.320] Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com/slash gold digger.
[00:26:43.320 --> 00:26:46.280] Go to shopify.com/slash gold digger.
[00:26:46.280 --> 00:26:49.480] Shopify.com/slash gold digger.
[00:26:52.360 --> 00:26:58.680] This podcast is brought to you by Mercury, banking that helps entrepreneurs do more with their money.
[00:26:58.680 --> 00:27:03.480] When I first started taking my business seriously, I remember feeling stretched thin.
[00:27:03.480 --> 00:27:08.600] I was juggling invoices, tracking payments, and managing cash flow across different tools.
[00:27:08.600 --> 00:27:12.040] It was messy, and I thought banking had to be that way.
[00:27:12.040 --> 00:27:14.520] That's why I was impressed with Mercury.
[00:27:14.520 --> 00:27:24.200] Unlike traditional banking that feels clunky and outdated, Mercury is designed to make managing money effortless so that you can focus on what actually grows your business.
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[00:27:32.600 --> 00:27:35.880] Plus, Mercury flexes to fit all types of businesses.
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[00:27:49.800 --> 00:27:53.160] For important details, check the show notes.
[00:27:53.800 --> 00:28:01.800] You know what's interesting is that I think a lot of times when people think about a website, they think about like the bare bones of it.
[00:28:02.120 --> 00:28:12.600] And what I think a lot of people don't consider is the fact that there are so many frameworks inside of a successful website, right?
[00:28:13.000 --> 00:28:18.320] It is not just like a hero image and a menu at the top and a contact button.
[00:28:14.840 --> 00:28:21.440] There are specific psychological things.
[00:28:21.760 --> 00:28:35.040] There are different selling tactics that can be woven in so incredibly thoughtfully, where you are really thinking about the positioning of the image, but also what sort of copy would go well at this point of the journey.
[00:28:35.040 --> 00:28:42.400] And then as you scroll down, what would be the next logical thing someone would need to know, believe, or understand in order to continue on?
[00:28:42.400 --> 00:28:44.800] And it's like when you think of a funnel, right?
[00:28:44.800 --> 00:29:04.640] If I think of cooking in the kitchen with my mom and pouring the flour in, a funnel, much as a sales funnel in terms of an email funnel, is very similar to a website when built properly, where as people continue to scroll, they continue to figure out and qualify themselves as a potential customer.
[00:29:04.640 --> 00:29:10.560] And I think that so many entrepreneurs get easily exhausted because they feel like they're constantly selling.
[00:29:10.560 --> 00:29:33.120] But I think when we really do think about this heavy lifting idea, the idea that your website shouldn't just be this generic place to land, but it should be thoughtfully structured in a systematic way that allows people to continue to qualify themselves as potential customers so that as they continue to scroll, they are qualifying themselves saying, Yes, this is what I'm looking for.
[00:29:33.120 --> 00:29:34.080] Yes, this is for me.
[00:29:34.080 --> 00:29:36.240] Oh my gosh, yes, I want that result.
[00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:43.360] And so there is a lot of scientific backing to a beautiful website, right?
[00:29:43.360 --> 00:29:47.760] It's not just what it looks like, it's how it makes somebody feel.
[00:29:47.760 --> 00:29:48.880] Absolutely.
[00:29:48.880 --> 00:29:49.200] Yeah.
[00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:52.800] And I think a lot of people don't realize like the strategy that goes into it.
[00:29:52.800 --> 00:29:56.480] And that's my job as a designer and as a template designer.
[00:29:56.480 --> 00:30:01.960] My job is to think: okay, what does someone need on this services page to make a buying decision?
[00:30:02.280 --> 00:30:09.560] How can I make this about page not just about this person, but ultimately make someone go, This is the person that I've been looking for.
[00:30:09.560 --> 00:30:13.160] This is the only person I can now imagine working with, right?
[00:30:13.160 --> 00:30:15.160] Like, I'm a little in love with this brand.
[00:30:15.160 --> 00:30:26.920] And so, there's so much strategy, there's so much possibility that goes into web design, which is why I'm just such a nerd about it because I love figuring out: wait a second, how do we sell beautifully?
[00:30:26.920 --> 00:30:28.520] How do we sell ethically?
[00:30:28.520 --> 00:30:29.960] How do we sell well?
[00:30:29.960 --> 00:30:31.800] How do we build that liquid depth?
[00:30:31.800 --> 00:30:37.400] Like, oh, wow, this is unique and different brand in a sea of everything that looks and sounds the same.
[00:30:37.400 --> 00:30:44.680] And so, I think that it's just incredible to see when you browse a well-done website, you go, ooh, this feels amazing.
[00:30:44.680 --> 00:30:48.440] And I think that's why, like, people come to me about your website all the time.
[00:30:48.440 --> 00:30:52.040] Every single time we've redone it, people have been like, Wow, there's something about this.
[00:30:52.040 --> 00:30:57.560] And I think that's what they're not realizing is like that's what they're seeing is like the level of intention behind it.
[00:30:57.560 --> 00:31:00.840] And that's what I think can be so effective when you put those pieces together.
[00:31:00.840 --> 00:31:01.720] Oh my gosh.
[00:31:01.720 --> 00:31:08.920] Okay, so I want to flash this back a handful of years to when Jen came to my house.
[00:31:08.920 --> 00:31:14.680] We lived in a hundred-year-old craftsman on the river in Wisconsin.
[00:31:14.680 --> 00:31:16.280] I greeted Jen at the door.
[00:31:16.280 --> 00:31:21.000] I had on this classic vintage sweatshirt that I stole from my father-in-law.
[00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:22.200] Thank you, Russ.
[00:31:22.200 --> 00:31:26.840] That has a bear with antlers, and then it just says beer with a question mark on it.
[00:31:27.000 --> 00:31:28.360] I think he was drinking a beer.
[00:31:28.360 --> 00:31:31.400] Like, I have this memory of the deer, like, maybe drinking a beer.
[00:31:31.480 --> 00:31:33.480] I was very not classy.
[00:31:33.480 --> 00:31:36.920] And Jen and I sat down at this table.
[00:31:36.920 --> 00:31:43.960] And one of the things that I have always had to figure out, and so many people in my audience are also struggling.
[00:31:43.960 --> 00:33:22.920] You, the listener, might be thinking this is like how can you have a website be effective if you want to do more than one thing right because i am a multi-passionate entrepreneur i've always been and i think that a lot of my listeners are like this is awesome but like i don't want to lock myself into one thing for the next 10 years or i can't imagine not doing all of the things that make me me and i remember we literally had papers out and we were mapping out because at the time i was a wedding photographer but i was also starting the digital side of my company building your first course yes of course how do i not confuse brides or deter them but also how do i speak to other photographers and so what would you say like how can you structure a website let's say if somebody's listening and maybe they're testing out different ideas or they have multiple offers or their business spans many different passions how do you not make it confusing or chaotic yeah i mean it's a great question and like you know going to your current site now there's so much like you contain multitudes you know but i do too like as adhd entrepreneurs like i'm ever going to do one thing no that's never going to happen so so anyway i think that this is just such a common thing you know and so if you're struggling to figure out how your offers are going to work together just know that like this is the most common problem that i see in website design and i think a lot of it just goes down to clarity and clear signpost and so for example for you it was as simple as being like, okay, there are kind of two customers that are visiting this site: people who are brides and people who are looking for business coaching.
[00:33:22.920 --> 00:33:26.600] And so we are going to make it caveman stupid simple.
[00:33:26.600 --> 00:33:28.920] If you are a bride, click here.
[00:33:28.920 --> 00:33:32.280] And so it was like a top menu item: brides.
[00:33:32.280 --> 00:33:36.760] And it was like very clear: weddings, you know, super simple offer.
[00:33:36.760 --> 00:33:43.960] And so one of the biggest things I think is a huge opportunity is creating those divisions of offers in your site menu.
[00:33:43.960 --> 00:33:50.280] And so maybe if you are a, this is the most common one I see, wedding photographer or photographer and business coach.
[00:33:50.280 --> 00:34:00.360] And so it could be as simple as weddings, coaching, you know, and your about section can be a little bit about both, but really treating those as individual sales pages.
[00:34:00.360 --> 00:34:11.800] And the way I think about it is that your website is like an incredible hostess at a restaurant who they are going to take you where you need to go and you're going to be guided to the chair.
[00:34:11.800 --> 00:34:13.160] It's going to be pulled out for you.
[00:34:13.160 --> 00:34:14.520] And it's like, here you are.
[00:34:14.520 --> 00:34:15.560] Here's the menu.
[00:34:15.560 --> 00:34:16.520] Here's what you need.
[00:34:16.520 --> 00:34:17.560] It's brunch.
[00:34:17.560 --> 00:34:18.680] Like here's the menu.
[00:34:18.680 --> 00:34:20.920] And so I think that's what the website needs to do.
[00:34:20.920 --> 00:34:23.480] It needs to guide people to the right decision.
[00:34:23.480 --> 00:34:28.200] And my best advice is always to make it as simple and clear as possible.
[00:34:28.200 --> 00:34:38.600] And so it could be as simple as having two things underneath your menu that it's like for brides, for coaching, or like this service, this service, this service.
[00:34:38.600 --> 00:34:40.520] Here are three ways to work with me.
[00:34:40.520 --> 00:34:43.960] And our brains are very much created to value order.
[00:34:43.960 --> 00:34:48.280] And so I'm a big fan, and you'll see this in lots of our templates of a one, two, three.
[00:34:48.280 --> 00:34:51.000] Here's this, here's this, and here's this.
[00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:58.600] And so people know as soon as they click that decision, they're going to be taken to a page that makes sense for specifically that offer.
[00:34:58.600 --> 00:35:03.160] And so I recommend having like a sales page, kind of specifically for each.
[00:35:03.160 --> 00:35:06.200] We build like a mini sales page into each of our templates.
[00:35:06.200 --> 00:35:10.440] So it might say weddings, and everything on that page is going to be exactly what you need.
[00:35:10.440 --> 00:35:11.720] It could say coaching.
[00:35:11.720 --> 00:35:14.040] It's going to go, everything is going to be on that page.
[00:35:14.040 --> 00:35:17.120] You're going to give them the information that they need to make that buying decision.
[00:35:17.440 --> 00:35:31.200] So I think the biggest thing is just starting with the paper, right, or starting with your Google Doc that maps out who's visiting the site, what information do they need to make that decision to know, like, and trust me that I can do this.
[00:35:31.200 --> 00:35:32.400] What do they need to know?
[00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:33.680] What do they need to do?
[00:35:34.000 --> 00:35:35.360] And then what do they need to do next?
[00:35:35.360 --> 00:35:41.280] What is the call to action that they're going to take at the end of this little mini funnel on those pages?
[00:35:41.280 --> 00:35:49.280] But the biggest thing is really just having that clarity at the front end of who's visiting and what actions are they going to take to find out more information.
[00:35:49.280 --> 00:35:49.760] Yes.
[00:35:49.760 --> 00:35:50.560] Oh my gosh.
[00:35:50.560 --> 00:35:51.120] I love it.
[00:35:51.120 --> 00:35:56.640] And I think sometimes people get so overwhelmed because they're like, I need eight different websites.
[00:35:56.720 --> 00:36:02.720] It's like, no, no, no, you can have one home that very clearly helps people know where to go, right?
[00:36:02.720 --> 00:36:07.360] Like you can very thoughtfully do it without alienating anyone.
[00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:14.800] Because also, if you're multi-passionate, there's a good chance that the people that you are serving are also that way too, and they might see themselves in you.
[00:36:15.120 --> 00:36:30.240] Really quickly, on your homepage, we decided very quickly that they needed to first know who you are, but we didn't immediately go into your courses next or even the podcast next because the most important place for them to go on your website was to your freebies.
[00:36:30.240 --> 00:36:35.760] Because as you talk about all the time, like your email list is where you do the vast majority of your selling, us too.
[00:36:35.760 --> 00:36:37.280] It's website and email.
[00:36:37.280 --> 00:36:43.920] And so the first thing that was the priority was like, let's have a beautiful freebie, a beautiful selection of freebies.
[00:36:43.920 --> 00:36:48.160] And based on the freebie they chose, you're going to kind of know what they're most interested in.
[00:36:48.160 --> 00:36:50.800] And so that was the most important thing.
[00:36:50.800 --> 00:36:53.520] A lot of other people would have said, well, just put the podcast.
[00:36:53.520 --> 00:36:55.520] Like, that's probably where people know her from.
[00:36:55.520 --> 00:36:56.720] Put that up top.
[00:36:56.720 --> 00:36:59.280] No, we wanted them to see this no matter what.
[00:36:59.280 --> 00:37:06.520] And so that decision of having those be beautiful, immediately eye-catching, near the top, we knew we wanted people to take that action.
[00:37:06.840 --> 00:37:09.000] And so that's what we prioritize first.
[00:37:09.000 --> 00:37:18.600] Well, and also from a strategic standpoint, if we just send people to the podcast, which thank you for being here, I don't know who you are.
[00:37:18.600 --> 00:37:18.920] Yeah.
[00:37:18.920 --> 00:37:21.000] I have no way to get in touch with you.
[00:37:21.000 --> 00:37:29.240] If three months from now I have something that you would want, there is no certified way to make sure that you get it, right?
[00:37:29.720 --> 00:37:50.760] And so when we're thinking about it from a strategic standpoint too, if you're doing all of this work to get somebody onto your website and you're not thoughtfully considering how can I make sure I stay in touch and can continue to serve them, then that is a huge missed opportunity because your website can absolutely do the heavy lifting and the selling for you.
[00:37:50.760 --> 00:37:55.400] But a lot of times too, people are in their research phase or their planning phase.
[00:37:55.400 --> 00:38:15.560] And so if there's a way that you can capture their information and stay in touch with them, then as Jen said, as this longer tail sales process that we're often seeing now happens, the more that you show up and serve them, the more likely they are to buy from you, whether it's immediately today or it's six months from now.
[00:38:15.560 --> 00:38:20.680] And so when we were even planning out the website, it's not just like, well, what are you most known for?
[00:38:20.760 --> 00:38:22.120] Where can we send people to?
[00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:28.520] It's like, how do we actually build something that we own and have control over that experience?
[00:38:28.520 --> 00:38:36.120] Your website is pretty much the only place on the entire web where you are in control of someone's experience.
[00:38:36.120 --> 00:38:38.680] I can't control somebody's experience on YouTube.
[00:38:38.680 --> 00:38:41.400] I can't control somebody's experience on this podcast.
[00:38:41.400 --> 00:38:45.920] After you listen to the show, there's probably other recommended shows or other things are popping up.
[00:38:45.920 --> 00:38:47.040] I don't know.
[00:38:47.040 --> 00:38:57.200] And so, what's so beautiful about a website is like you are in control of that experience of how they move through it, but also what happens after it.
[00:38:57.200 --> 00:39:09.440] And that's why I think there is so much beautiful and thoughtful strategy when it comes to a website in thinking through those types of things so that it's doing all the work for you, right?
[00:39:09.440 --> 00:39:16.800] Whether it is making the immediate sale or capturing somebody's information so that you can serve them and then eventually sell to them.
[00:39:16.800 --> 00:39:20.480] I can't tell you how many people who are like, oh, I've been on your email list for six months.
[00:39:20.480 --> 00:39:22.400] Like, I found you online.
[00:39:22.400 --> 00:39:23.200] I found you on social.
[00:39:23.200 --> 00:39:23.920] I went to your website.
[00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:24.640] I got this freebie.
[00:39:24.640 --> 00:39:25.600] I've been here for six months.
[00:39:25.600 --> 00:39:26.880] Like, I've been saving up.
[00:39:26.880 --> 00:39:34.400] Now I'm buying, you know, and it was all because of that through line experience of they waited, they researched, they got all the information.
[00:39:34.400 --> 00:39:36.000] They read every page of our website.
[00:39:36.000 --> 00:39:37.040] Like, we can see the back end.
[00:39:37.040 --> 00:39:39.600] Like, oh, you spent 13 minutes on our website.
[00:39:39.600 --> 00:39:40.400] Amazing.
[00:39:40.400 --> 00:39:44.320] And so then they have that time, but we have the information that we need.
[00:39:44.320 --> 00:39:51.280] And that's like we build freebies and we build pop-ups, we build everything into the websites because you need to know those people.
[00:39:51.280 --> 00:39:55.440] Every other platform is really trying to keep you from knowing those people, right?
[00:39:55.440 --> 00:39:59.200] They are making it difficult for you to have any reach to your audience.
[00:39:59.200 --> 00:40:02.800] But when someone's on your website, you have their full attention.
[00:40:02.800 --> 00:40:04.400] And that is so impactful.
[00:40:04.400 --> 00:40:07.200] That attention currency is so valuable.
[00:40:07.200 --> 00:40:09.520] And so what are you going to do with it once you have them?
[00:40:09.520 --> 00:40:10.640] It's so important.
[00:40:10.640 --> 00:40:11.040] Yes.
[00:40:11.040 --> 00:40:11.440] Okay.
[00:40:11.440 --> 00:40:16.160] Let's say someone that is listening, our listener today, they just have one hour.
[00:40:16.160 --> 00:40:21.840] So they have one hour, and they maybe have a website or they're looking at building one.
[00:40:21.840 --> 00:40:24.320] What is one high-impact change?
[00:40:24.320 --> 00:40:34.920] Let's say for somebody that has a website that they could make today that could help move the needle on I love this question because I do think people mostly approach it as an all-or-nothing.
[00:40:29.840 --> 00:40:44.040] Like, it's like, I'm going to burn my website down and rise like a phoenix from the ashes, and maybe I'll do that in four years because nobody got time for that.
[00:40:44.040 --> 00:40:49.480] I'm a big proponent of like, just make it a little better, like, just make it a little bit better today.
[00:40:49.800 --> 00:40:52.680] First piece of advice: start where the money is, right?
[00:40:52.680 --> 00:40:56.280] So, start where people are making a buying decision on your website.
[00:40:56.280 --> 00:41:03.000] Maybe that's your services page, maybe it's your coaching page or your course page, whatever it is you're selling.
[00:41:03.000 --> 00:41:09.800] How could you maybe add more social proof to that page and say, Okay, I have some updated testimonials, I'm gonna do that.
[00:41:09.800 --> 00:41:17.160] Or people are going to my portfolio, but nothing I've posted on Instagram in the past year is actually on my website.
[00:41:17.160 --> 00:41:21.480] So, people are going to my website and it doesn't even match what I'm my work now.
[00:41:21.480 --> 00:41:23.560] So, start where the money is.
[00:41:23.560 --> 00:41:25.800] Make a couple of little upgrades.
[00:41:25.800 --> 00:41:28.120] Add a project to your portfolio.
[00:41:28.120 --> 00:41:32.840] Change the wording to make sure what you're actually selling on your website is what you're currently selling.
[00:41:32.840 --> 00:41:35.720] But start with where people are making that buying decision.
[00:41:35.720 --> 00:41:41.320] And the second one is just look at your above-the-fold headline that we just talked about earlier.
[00:41:41.320 --> 00:41:47.240] Is it abundantly clear what you do immediately when I land on your website, right?
[00:41:47.240 --> 00:41:59.080] Like, within 0.08 seconds, I should have total clarity, caveman simple clarity about what you do and who you are and who you're for, and maybe even who you're not for immediately on your website.
[00:41:59.080 --> 00:42:05.800] So, those are the two things: start where the money is, and then ensure that that above the fold, above the fold, above the rest.
[00:42:05.800 --> 00:42:11.960] Like, priorize that above everything else, and then everything will make sense further on as you go.
[00:42:12.520 --> 00:42:14.960] I love that, and I totally agree.
[00:42:14.600 --> 00:42:18.160] You have to lose the all-or-nothing mentality.
[00:42:18.480 --> 00:42:24.320] You have to lose the perfect like following that and waiting to hit publish.
[00:42:24.320 --> 00:42:28.240] Like, nobody cares about your website as much as you do.
[00:42:28.240 --> 00:42:33.040] And at the same point, like, just published is better than sitting in a draft.
[00:42:33.040 --> 00:42:35.440] Like, just get it out there.
[00:42:36.000 --> 00:42:37.600] You will start to collect data.
[00:42:37.600 --> 00:42:39.200] You will start to see results.
[00:42:39.200 --> 00:42:40.800] You will start to get insights.
[00:42:40.800 --> 00:42:43.040] Like, so get anything out there.
[00:42:43.040 --> 00:42:50.720] I am like the queen of spaghetti at the wall and like constantly just tweaking and refining and building and like moving things around.
[00:42:50.720 --> 00:42:53.200] And, like, I just think get it out there.
[00:42:53.200 --> 00:42:54.640] Like, there it out there.
[00:42:54.640 --> 00:42:55.760] And you can make it better.
[00:42:55.760 --> 00:43:01.520] That's the beauty of the website that you own and that you can edit is that next week you could make it a little bit better.
[00:43:01.520 --> 00:43:02.800] Like, you could add something.
[00:43:02.800 --> 00:43:05.440] You could, you don't have to wait for new brand photos.
[00:43:05.440 --> 00:43:07.520] You could add new brand photos next week.
[00:43:07.520 --> 00:43:13.280] And this is one of the things I love about you as a client is that every six months, you're like, okay, time for some updates.
[00:43:13.280 --> 00:43:14.480] Like, let's make it fresh.
[00:43:14.480 --> 00:43:15.920] Like, how can we improve it?
[00:43:15.920 --> 00:43:24.000] Most people design their website and then they wait until they hate it, which is usually like two weeks later, and then like wait four years to do anything about it.
[00:43:24.000 --> 00:43:24.720] And I'm like, no, no, no.
[00:43:24.880 --> 00:43:27.680] Your website should evolve with you.
[00:43:27.680 --> 00:43:33.280] You want it to represent who you are going to be and who you're becoming, not who you were four years ago.
[00:43:33.280 --> 00:43:38.000] And so this is like your siren call: like, don't think your website is dead.
[00:43:38.000 --> 00:43:41.840] It is a living, breathing representation of your business.
[00:43:41.840 --> 00:43:43.280] So how can you operate it?
[00:43:43.280 --> 00:43:46.400] Like one, because that's when it begins to serve you so well.
[00:43:46.400 --> 00:43:49.040] So don't miss out on that possibility.
[00:43:49.040 --> 00:43:52.880] Before we wrap up, let's thank our sponsors for making this episode possible.
[00:43:52.880 --> 00:44:01.240] And hey, if this conversation sparked a few ideas for your own brand or website, consider sending it to a friend who's in a season of redesign or reinvention.
[00:44:01.240 --> 00:44:09.480] Coming up, I'm sharing a personal story that you haven't heard and the big reason why I keep coming back to Jen again and again.
[00:44:10.440 --> 00:44:14.840] Can we talk about how bad underwear can ruin your entire day?
[00:44:14.840 --> 00:44:18.680] Like I used to put on underwear in a bra knowing that I'd be adjusting it by 10 a.m.
[00:44:18.680 --> 00:44:21.080] and completely over it by lunchtime.
[00:44:21.080 --> 00:44:24.920] That is why I am obsessed with the Skims Fits Everybody collection.
[00:44:24.920 --> 00:44:29.560] Now I've bought Skims for years, but I swear this line is a total game changer.
[00:44:29.560 --> 00:44:35.000] The Fits Everybody scoop ralette has buttery soft fabric that literally feels like nothing.
[00:44:35.000 --> 00:44:36.920] And I mean that in the best way.
[00:44:36.920 --> 00:44:40.040] I can put it on and I forget that it exists.
[00:44:40.040 --> 00:44:45.400] I'm so confident in these pieces that when I packed my Grease suitcase, it was basically all skims.
[00:44:45.400 --> 00:44:51.560] I even wore their bodysuit for a recent branding photo shoot because when something fits this well, you just trust it.
[00:44:51.560 --> 00:44:58.840] When your underwear actually works, you stop wasting precious mental energy on it and you can focus on everything else that matters.
[00:44:58.840 --> 00:45:03.560] If you're tired of uncomfortable intimates, this is your sign to try Fits Everybody.
[00:45:03.560 --> 00:45:07.240] Shop Skims Fits Everybody Collection at skims.com.
[00:45:07.240 --> 00:45:09.960] Once you place your order, make sure to let them know we sent you.
[00:45:09.960 --> 00:45:15.720] Just select podcast in the survey and choose the Gold Digger podcast in the drop-down menu that follows.
[00:45:17.000 --> 00:45:20.760] You know that sinking feeling when you see your latest campaign report?
[00:45:20.760 --> 00:45:24.680] 87% of your budget went to people who would never buy from you?
[00:45:24.680 --> 00:45:30.360] Random scrollers clicking your business course ad, students engaging with your entrepreneur content.
[00:45:30.360 --> 00:45:36.360] You're perfect ad creative about building sustainable income shown to people who aren't even trying to build a business.
[00:45:36.360 --> 00:45:38.600] That's why LinkedIn ads exist.
[00:45:38.600 --> 00:45:43.800] While other platforms guess who might be interested, LinkedIn knows who your buyers are.
[00:45:43.800 --> 00:45:47.680] Target the exact job titles making purchasing decisions.
[00:45:47.680 --> 00:45:50.320] Reach VPs of marketing at growing companies.
[00:45:50.320 --> 00:45:53.040] Find HR directors at mid-sized firms.
[00:45:53.040 --> 00:45:56.000] Target entrepreneurs ready to invest in their growth.
[00:45:56.000 --> 00:45:58.720] Zero waste, maximum impact.
[00:45:58.720 --> 00:46:06.960] Stop hemorrhaging budget on random audiences and start reaching actual decision makers who can write the checks only with LinkedIn ads.
[00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:13.360] Spend $250 on your first campaign on LinkedIn ads and get a free $250 credit for the next one.
[00:46:13.360 --> 00:46:16.240] Just go to linkedin.com/slash goal.
[00:46:16.240 --> 00:46:19.360] That's linkedin.com slash G-O-A-L.
[00:46:19.360 --> 00:46:21.920] Terms and conditions apply.
[00:46:23.200 --> 00:46:25.680] This message is sponsored by Greenlight.
[00:46:25.680 --> 00:46:29.600] My six-year-old woke up this morning asking if she could do chores to earn money.
[00:46:29.600 --> 00:46:30.240] Why?
[00:46:30.240 --> 00:46:34.560] Because she read a fancy Nancy book where Nancy worked to buy fabulous shoes.
[00:46:34.560 --> 00:46:39.920] And suddenly, my daughter wanted to experience the same pride of buying something special with her own money.
[00:46:39.920 --> 00:46:46.000] But here's what hit me: I had no good way to help her actually see and feel her money growing.
[00:46:46.000 --> 00:46:47.440] Cash gets lost.
[00:46:47.440 --> 00:46:53.440] Piggy banks are abstract, and she can't really understand the connection between effort and reward.
[00:46:53.440 --> 00:46:55.440] That's why we started using Greenlight.
[00:46:55.440 --> 00:47:02.240] Greenlight is the easy, convenient way for parents to raise financially smart kids and for families to navigate life together.
[00:47:02.240 --> 00:47:09.840] And maybe that's why millions of parents trust and kids love learning about money on Greenlight, the number one family finance and safety app.
[00:47:09.840 --> 00:47:13.920] Now, when she does chores, I can instantly send her earnings to her card.
[00:47:13.920 --> 00:47:18.800] She watches her balance grow in real time and feels genuine ownership over her money.
[00:47:18.800 --> 00:47:25.120] And when she's ready for those fabulous shoes, she'll swipe her own card and experience that incredible feeling Nancy had.
[00:47:25.120 --> 00:47:27.760] Don't wait to teach your kids real-world money skills.
[00:47:27.760 --> 00:47:32.200] Start your risk-free Green Light trial today at greenlight.com slash gold digger.
[00:47:32.200 --> 00:47:35.400] That's greenlight.com/slash gold digger to get started.
[00:47:35.400 --> 00:47:38.440] Greenlight.com slash gold digger.
[00:47:39.400 --> 00:47:51.560] One final thing I have to share, just because I'm like so proud, but it's just really truly a testament to the power of the platform and the templates is this entire summer we have had our head down.
[00:47:51.560 --> 00:48:07.240] So we've done no launches and we were on our team call yesterday and we realized that over the summer we have updated 10 different landing pages on our own in terms of copy, images, et cetera, using templates.
[00:48:07.240 --> 00:48:08.760] So we didn't really change the design.
[00:48:08.760 --> 00:48:10.200] We just went through.
[00:48:10.200 --> 00:48:14.520] After we did a big survey of our audience, we were like, wow, we have new language.
[00:48:14.520 --> 00:48:15.480] We have new words.
[00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:17.000] We know what their desires are.
[00:48:17.000 --> 00:48:23.960] Okay, how do we go page by page through our site and apply what we now know to be true?
[00:48:23.960 --> 00:48:27.160] And we did it all without even talking to you, right?
[00:48:27.480 --> 00:48:28.120] No idea.
[00:48:28.120 --> 00:48:28.680] So proud.
[00:48:28.680 --> 00:48:29.480] Star student.
[00:48:30.520 --> 00:48:34.120] Probably the best thing is like the mom being like, go, baby, you got this.
[00:48:35.160 --> 00:48:43.160] And so on our team call yesterday, we were like recognizing like, wow, we have gone through so many pages and refined them.
[00:48:43.160 --> 00:48:49.800] We're doing fun things like split testing just the hero sections of pages and seeing which one performs better.
[00:48:49.800 --> 00:48:55.560] Like we are in a place where we can be so crazy strategic because we have control.
[00:48:55.560 --> 00:49:02.480] And so regardless of if you buy a template from Jen or not, if you do not have control of your website.
[00:49:02.480 --> 00:49:13.800] And if you do not feel creatively empowered to log in and move things around and change things and update things, I would argue that now is the time.
[00:49:13.800 --> 00:49:24.800] You need to own your site and you need to not just own it, you need to have the ownership in it that like it is yours to care for, to be creative with, to have fun with.
[00:49:24.800 --> 00:49:30.320] And it changes the entire emotion game feeling around a website.
[00:49:30.320 --> 00:49:34.640] Like I love sending people to my website because I'm like, go, go check it out.
[00:49:34.640 --> 00:49:36.800] It is a party on the internet.
[00:49:36.800 --> 00:49:38.000] It is my home.
[00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:38.880] Come on in.
[00:49:38.880 --> 00:49:50.160] And so I just think for so many people listening who feel stifled or paralyzed or feel like they're not tech savvy enough or who feel trapped or who feel stuck, it doesn't have to be that way.
[00:49:50.160 --> 00:49:51.840] It doesn't have to be that way.
[00:49:51.840 --> 00:49:53.200] It doesn't have to be that way.
[00:49:53.200 --> 00:49:56.720] And people can't miss what they've never had, you know, and that's what I think is the case.
[00:49:56.720 --> 00:50:00.880] Is I'm like, you should be telling the grocery store checkout guy to go to your website, right?
[00:50:00.880 --> 00:50:08.240] Like you should, because, because I can't tell you how many times I'm at a conference, I meet one of the speakers or one of the attendees, they're crushing it.
[00:50:08.240 --> 00:50:10.640] Like followers, content, everything.
[00:50:10.640 --> 00:50:13.120] And they're like, oh, please don't go to my website.
[00:50:13.120 --> 00:50:22.480] And I'm like, well, no, like this is like my, the worst thing I hear on the daily because I'm like, you are too talented to have a website you're embarrassed by.
[00:50:22.480 --> 00:50:24.240] You are too talented.
[00:50:24.240 --> 00:50:26.240] So don't let that happen to you.
[00:50:26.240 --> 00:50:28.000] It doesn't have to be one of our templates.
[00:50:28.000 --> 00:50:30.320] There are resources available to you.
[00:50:30.320 --> 00:50:34.800] And the other thing I want to highlight that you just said is you audited your website.
[00:50:34.800 --> 00:50:36.480] You looked at your website.
[00:50:36.480 --> 00:50:40.000] You went to your website and were like, what could be performing better?
[00:50:40.000 --> 00:50:42.800] And that's something that, like, often, I mean, how long?
[00:50:42.800 --> 00:50:45.840] Like, let's just moment of truth, listening to the podcast.
[00:50:45.840 --> 00:50:51.600] Dear listener, when is the last time you went to your website and looked at it with fresh eyes?
[00:50:51.600 --> 00:50:59.280] Like, I'm a designer, and I can take too long to go to our tonic homepage and go, like, oh, that could use a, that person doesn't work here.
[00:50:59.280 --> 00:51:00.840] Like, or that's an old freebie.
[00:50:59.840 --> 00:51:02.920] You need to look at it with fresh eyes.
[00:51:03.160 --> 00:51:12.840] And one of the things that we did this last year, similar last summer, I was going through our website just trying to find those places where it wasn't converting as high as it needed to.
[00:51:12.840 --> 00:51:21.320] And my brother, who's like this AI genius and is always like pulling me into the future, you know, somewhat against my will, he was like, Hey, let me send you.
[00:51:21.320 --> 00:51:29.400] I actually came up with these really great ChapGBT prompts to help audit your website like it's your ideal customer browsing your website.
[00:51:29.400 --> 00:51:31.000] And so, I sent them to you.
[00:51:31.000 --> 00:51:40.040] They are so helpful because it literally just narrates like what is your ideal customer thinking or feeling as they scroll whatever page you upload.
[00:51:40.040 --> 00:51:41.320] And the prompts were so helpful.
[00:51:41.320 --> 00:51:48.920] And so, basically, it identified all of these things where, like, I thought this was fine on the page, but it was actually creating confusion.
[00:51:48.920 --> 00:51:53.720] Or, like, actually, what our ideal customer was thinking is this sounds too good to be true.
[00:51:53.720 --> 00:51:59.480] Like, I'm overwhelmed by my website, and they're making this sound so easy, but it probably isn't.
[00:51:59.480 --> 00:52:04.760] So, we immediately began to take some of that feedback and be like, Hey, this isn't easy.
[00:52:04.760 --> 00:52:06.120] Websites are overwhelming.
[00:52:06.120 --> 00:52:11.160] We hear it, and that's why we have this amazing support team who's available to help you.
[00:52:11.160 --> 00:52:15.960] That's why we have all of these reviews saying, It was kind of hard, but it was so worth it.
[00:52:15.960 --> 00:52:24.120] So, we were able to take what that audit said and immediately, like you did with your customer reviews and your survey, and incorporate those things back into our website.
[00:52:24.120 --> 00:52:28.120] So, I think we have that on your tonic landing page that we'll mention in a second.
[00:52:28.120 --> 00:52:37.480] But those prompts were just phenomenally helpful in helping us audit our website and just improve, improve, improve, improve, because we own it because we can do that at any time.
[00:52:37.480 --> 00:52:44.040] It's so funny because it'll be like literally like, I just want to change two words, and it takes 10 seconds, right?
[00:52:44.040 --> 00:52:47.920] Like, it doesn't have to be this huge overhaul.
[00:52:48.160 --> 00:52:58.320] Like, it can be these like really subtle shifts in language or the way you're speaking about yourself or your offer or the way that your client speaks about you, right?
[00:52:58.320 --> 00:52:58.800] Yes.
[00:52:58.800 --> 00:53:00.720] And so, oh, it's just amazing.
[00:53:00.720 --> 00:53:01.280] Okay.
[00:53:01.280 --> 00:53:13.440] So, my final question is: what are some of the common things that people include on their sites that are either totally unnecessary or that might be actively hurting their chances of making a sale?
[00:53:13.440 --> 00:53:16.160] And maybe they'll learn this when they audit.
[00:53:16.160 --> 00:53:21.040] Yeah, I mean, I do think that that's where we began to see, like, oh, we have a Pollyanna problem.
[00:53:21.040 --> 00:53:27.760] We have all these things saying, like, it's really easy, and people don't believe that, you know, so we need to actually decrease the friction that someone's feeling.
[00:53:27.760 --> 00:53:28.640] So, that's a huge one.
[00:53:28.640 --> 00:53:33.440] Definitely look at the audit for sure because you're also going to see the information that's like, why is this here?
[00:53:33.440 --> 00:53:35.680] Like, this doesn't make sense to me.
[00:53:35.680 --> 00:53:38.000] It's very humbling, but also helpful.
[00:53:38.000 --> 00:53:39.680] I'm like, this is what we need.
[00:53:39.680 --> 00:53:45.440] But the most common things that I see are just too much information.
[00:53:45.440 --> 00:53:51.120] You are drowning your people in information that is clogging up your website.
[00:53:51.120 --> 00:53:57.680] And so, people are just slogging through every possible thing that they don't need at that exact moment.
[00:53:57.680 --> 00:54:05.360] And so, you want to think, like, what does someone need to know or believe that's going to help them get more information about this product?
[00:54:05.360 --> 00:54:09.760] Like, what do they need to know or believe or what action do they need to take?
[00:54:09.760 --> 00:54:12.880] How can I give them that and give them that thoroughly, right?
[00:54:12.880 --> 00:54:17.760] But we're not drowning them in, like, when I was six, when I first picked up a camera, right?
[00:54:17.760 --> 00:54:19.120] They don't care how old you were.
[00:54:19.200 --> 00:54:21.200] They care how you use the camera now, right?
[00:54:21.200 --> 00:54:26.400] So, those are the things I would say: like, think through strategically the information that you're including.
[00:54:26.400 --> 00:54:28.720] So, it's not just every possible thing.
[00:54:28.720 --> 00:54:33.880] You know, if you were a bride, you don't need to know at the very front of the process how much an album costs.
[00:54:34.440 --> 00:54:37.880] That information is not relevant to that person at that part of their buying journey.
[00:54:37.880 --> 00:54:38.280] It's not.
[00:54:38.280 --> 00:54:44.920] So, think through what do they need to know, believe, or do at this exact moment to take further action.
[00:54:44.920 --> 00:54:54.840] And then, this is like a very cheap and easy one, but my personal pet peeve is when a contact form has 27 questions and like a blood type and a social security request.
[00:54:54.840 --> 00:54:58.120] I'm like, this person's trying to get in touch with you.
[00:54:58.120 --> 00:54:59.320] Make that easy.
[00:54:59.320 --> 00:55:03.240] Make whatever action you want them to take so easy.
[00:55:03.240 --> 00:55:05.000] Reduce any friction.
[00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:06.520] And so, we've been guilty of this.
[00:55:06.520 --> 00:55:10.040] Our checkout process was like too many things.
[00:55:10.040 --> 00:55:14.120] And people were like, I tried to check out, but then I was having trouble on mobile.
[00:55:14.120 --> 00:55:20.520] And I'm like, this is the worst possible thing for there to be friction at that point where they are ready to take action.
[00:55:20.520 --> 00:55:25.800] So, go through your entire buying journey and be like, okay, what part of this felt hard?
[00:55:25.800 --> 00:55:28.520] Was there anything where I had to like stop and really think?
[00:55:28.520 --> 00:55:31.080] Did I have to go get something that I didn't have?
[00:55:31.080 --> 00:55:33.240] And so, it kept me from taking action.
[00:55:33.240 --> 00:55:35.480] Where can you reduce friction on your site?
[00:55:35.480 --> 00:55:39.720] That unnecessary friction is one of the biggest things that kills conversion.
[00:55:39.720 --> 00:55:41.000] And so, that's the biggest thing.
[00:55:41.000 --> 00:55:42.840] Just look for friction anywhere on your site.
[00:55:42.840 --> 00:55:43.640] Where was it difficult?
[00:55:43.640 --> 00:55:45.800] Where could someone not find what they needed?
[00:55:45.800 --> 00:55:48.440] Where did they get stuck because a link was broken?
[00:55:48.440 --> 00:55:57.320] Go through it and evaluate it like a client and then do that audit because that's where you're going to catch all those other things that like don't make sense or that someone's actually going, This doesn't resonate with me yet.
[00:55:57.320 --> 00:55:57.960] Why is this here?
[00:55:57.960 --> 00:55:59.000] I don't believe it.
[00:55:59.000 --> 00:55:59.640] Yes.
[00:55:59.640 --> 00:56:00.600] Oh my gosh.
[00:56:00.600 --> 00:56:01.400] Okay.
[00:56:01.400 --> 00:56:06.360] Tell us where everyone can find out more about you, the templates.
[00:56:06.360 --> 00:56:08.760] We have a special offer for our listeners.
[00:56:08.760 --> 00:56:15.040] Let me remind you: Jen was on episode number two of this very podcast.
[00:56:15.040 --> 00:56:16.800] You are the true OG.
[00:56:16.800 --> 00:56:19.280] That is how long we have been working together.
[00:56:14.600 --> 00:56:21.520] That is how long I have been a fan of hers.
[00:56:21.760 --> 00:56:33.120] And so I have watched so many of my best friends in the business hire you because I am the evangelist of like Jen creates the best templates.
[00:56:33.120 --> 00:56:39.520] I want everybody I know in my life to have one because there's something different about being proud of it.
[00:56:39.520 --> 00:56:41.200] So tell us a little bit more.
[00:56:41.200 --> 00:56:42.480] I'm so proud to tell you.
[00:56:42.480 --> 00:56:48.560] You can go to jennakutcher.com/slash tonic for the special offer that we've worked up and the website on it.
[00:56:48.560 --> 00:56:53.840] And then you can find me on my website that I'm very proud of at tonicsiteshop.com.
[00:56:53.840 --> 00:56:58.480] And if you want to go see our content on social, you can do that at tonic siteshop.
[00:56:58.480 --> 00:57:01.600] And then we're famous for our long and weird marketing newsletter.
[00:57:01.600 --> 00:57:11.760] And if you go to tonicsiteshop.com/slash list, you can get my long and weird emails every Friday that at least 12 people really, really love out of the 40,000.
[00:57:11.760 --> 00:57:13.120] I love them.
[00:57:13.120 --> 00:57:14.960] Jen, thank you so much.
[00:57:14.960 --> 00:57:20.080] I would just say, if anything, go and just browse jennakutcher.com/slash tonic.
[00:57:20.080 --> 00:57:30.480] We highlight our favorite templates and the ones that our audience goes nuts over, but even just study them, look at them, see how they're set up.
[00:57:30.480 --> 00:57:33.040] Like use it to inspire you.
[00:57:33.040 --> 00:57:42.320] Whether you purchase or not, I think there is so much gold to be uncovered inside of the design of my own website of this page.
[00:57:42.320 --> 00:57:44.320] And of course, go get that audit sheet.
[00:57:44.320 --> 00:57:45.360] You cannot find it anywhere else.
[00:57:45.360 --> 00:57:47.360] Jenna Kutcher.com slash tonic.
[00:57:47.360 --> 00:57:50.000] Jen, thank you for coming back on the show.
[00:57:50.000 --> 00:57:52.400] Thank you for being with me since the very beginning.
[00:57:53.200 --> 00:57:59.440] Thank you for giving me a chance to a beautiful home on the internet that I absolutely adore.
[00:57:59.440 --> 00:58:07.320] You have just really transformed the web for so many entrepreneurs, and it's just such a joy to walk alongside of you while you do it.
[00:58:07.320 --> 00:58:08.600] It's so good to be back.
[00:58:08.600 --> 00:58:09.480] Always fun.
[00:58:09.480 --> 00:58:14.680] And just, I'll always remember you in the sweatshirt with the bear drinking a beer, where it all began.
[00:58:14.680 --> 00:58:15.560] So thanks for it.
[00:58:15.720 --> 00:58:16.680] It all began.
[00:58:18.040 --> 00:58:20.040] Oh, thanks, Jen.
[00:58:20.680 --> 00:58:25.720] It's honestly crazy when I think about episode number two of the show.
[00:58:25.720 --> 00:58:31.720] Jen was the first person that I invited to ever come on this podcast years and years and years ago.
[00:58:31.720 --> 00:58:40.920] And she has just been a creative force in my business, but also the person I send people to every single time.
[00:58:40.920 --> 00:58:45.320] My best friends in the industry have now worked with Jen.
[00:58:45.320 --> 00:58:57.320] I sing her praises because she is so strategic and talented and thoughtful, not only when it comes to beautiful design, but also in thinking through the actual strategy of having your website work for you.
[00:58:57.320 --> 00:59:08.680] I hope this conversation leaves you feeling fired up and excited to get your website beautified, to make sure it's strategic, to heck, have a website at all if you don't have one yet.
[00:59:08.680 --> 00:59:14.520] And if a tonic template feels like the next right step for you, go to jennakutcher.com forward slash template.
[00:59:14.520 --> 00:59:16.200] They are absolutely stunning.
[00:59:16.200 --> 00:59:22.520] All of my websites have been based off of the templates and using the templates that Jen has created inside of the site shop.
[00:59:22.520 --> 00:59:23.720] And I am just obsessed.
[00:59:23.720 --> 00:59:26.680] They have changed my life and so many of your lives.
[00:59:26.680 --> 00:59:28.600] And I want to make sure that you have a template you love.
[00:59:28.600 --> 00:59:31.320] So jennakutcher.com forward slash tonic.
[00:59:31.320 --> 00:59:36.600] Jen has a special offer for us, as well as the audit that she shared in today's episode.
[00:59:36.600 --> 00:59:38.840] It's the only place you can find it on the internet.
[00:59:38.840 --> 00:59:44.280] Go get that audit, check out your site, and see what you need to do in order to make your site work for you.
[00:59:44.280 --> 00:59:47.280] That's Jenna Kutcher.com forward slash tonic.
[00:59:44.920 --> 00:59:50.640] Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Gold Digger Podcast.
[00:59:50.800 --> 00:59:57.600] If you know anyone who could benefit from tuning in, be a good friend and send it on over to them.
[00:59:57.600 --> 01:00:01.600] And until next time, Gold Diggers, keep on digging your biggest goals.
[01:00:01.600 --> 01:00:05.360] And thank you so much for listening to this episode of the podcast.
[01:00:06.000 --> 01:00:09.680] Thanks for pulling up a seat for another episode of the Gold Digger Podcast.
[01:00:09.680 --> 01:00:19.120] I hope today's episode filled you with inspiration, gave you information that you can turn into action, and realigned you with your true north in life and business.
[01:00:19.120 --> 01:00:29.680] If you've enjoyed today's episode, head on over to GoldDiggerPodcast.com for today's show notes, discount codes for our sponsors, freebies to fuel your results, and so much more.
[01:00:29.680 --> 01:00:34.240] And if you haven't yet, make sure you're subscribed so that you never miss a future show.
[01:00:34.240 --> 01:00:36.960] We'll see you next time, Gold Diggers.
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