We Can Do Hard Things

Brandi Carlile Has Returned to Herself

October 23, 2025

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  • Brandi Carlile's new album, *Returning to Myself*, is described by the host as her most personal and raw work yet, prompting deep emotional responses. 
  • The song "Returning to Myself" originated from a poem written during a challenging period while preparing for the Joni Mitchell Hollywood Bowl performance, symbolizing a necessary journey inward. 
  • The concept of "You Without Me" explores the profound, sometimes terrifying, realization of a loved one's independent existence and capability outside of the speaker's influence, a feeling the host deeply relates to regarding her own children. 
  • The song discussed offers a permission slip for imperfection within relationships, particularly serving as a gift to the lesbian community which often feels pressure to maintain a facade of perfection. 
  • The act of being truthful in art, even when detailing personal matters, can ultimately make the subject of the song (like Kath) seem even cooler and more admirable. 
  • The conversation concludes with the reminder that returning to oneself, though potentially lonely, is the only necessary path forward. 

Segments

Album Introduction and Vulnerability
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(00:00:16)
  • Key Takeaway: Brandi Carlile’s new album, Returning to Myself, is anticipated to be her most vulnerable and raw work yet.
  • Summary: The host expresses excitement for the deeply personal nature of Brandi Carlile’s new album, Returning to Myself. She notes that Brandi is about to get more vulnerable and raw than ever before. The host considers the Carliles to be family who have significantly impacted their lives.
Avoiding New Music
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(00:02:37)
  • Key Takeaway: The host avoids listening to new music from Brandi Carlile because it tends to cause emotional ‘spills’ from a ‘very full vase’ inside her.
  • Summary: The host admitted to avoiding Brandi Carlile’s new music because it is emotionally potent and causes her to spill over. A mutual daughter, Tish, had previously declared the album to be the ‘best album ever.’ The host finally listened to the entire album early Saturday morning and agrees with Tish’s assessment.
Writer’s ‘Stet’ and Album Origin
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(00:04:17)
  • Key Takeaway: Brandi Carlile feels an unprecedented, jarring love for Returning to Myself, reaching a point of artistic conviction where she would not change a single thing, embodying the publishing term ‘stet.’
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile expressed an unusual, jarring love for her new album, feeling proud but also unwilling to alter anything, which she equates to the publishing term ‘stet’ (meaning ’leave it as is’). The title track, ‘Returning to Myself,’ was the first thing she wrote, stemming from a poem written after witnessing Joni Mitchell’s profound return to her own difficult music.
The Barn and Solitude
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(00:07:42)
  • Key Takeaway: The initial writing session for the album occurred in unexpected, isolated solitude in an upstate New York barn, forcing Brandi Carlile to confront being ‘miserably and utterly alone.’
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile planned a songwriting trip to meet Aaron Dessner in Upstate New York, only to realize upon arrival that she had to sleep alone in a barn without an instrument. This forced isolation led her to write the poem ‘Returning to Myself’ while feeling miserably and utterly alone, a state she is uncomfortable with.
Inward vs. Outward Living
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(00:09:15)
  • Key Takeaway: Brandi Carlile contrasts her primal, outward way of being with her wife’s performance-oriented hosting style, noting her own discomfort with true aloneness.
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile acknowledges that Glennon and Kath have taught her to live more in community, contrasting with her own primal, carnal way of being where she is comfortable being ‘alone with people.’ She finds true aloneness uncomfortable, feeling dormant and like she is wasting time without distractions like games or reading.
Meaning of ‘Returning to Myself’
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(00:11:58)
  • Key Takeaway: For Brandi Carlile, ‘Returning to Myself’ means accepting that solitude was the only path forward to create the album, ultimately leading to a return to her family.
  • Summary: The line ‘Returning to myself is lonely thing to do, but it’s the only thing to do’ meant that the solitude in the barn was the only option available for creation. She concluded that returning to herself meant returning herself to her family after a period of intense ambition focused on seizing every opportunity.
Analysis of ‘A Woman Overseas’
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(00:13:36)
  • Key Takeaway: The song ‘A Woman Overseas’ is about Kath, exploring the dynamic where Kath’s charismatic interest in others leads to them oversharing, leaving the narrator wondering about the depths of Kath’s own internal world.
  • Summary: The song is about Kath, contrasting the line ‘A woman I know’ with the ending line ‘A woman no one knows.’ Brandi Carlile describes Kath as a socially graceful puppeteer who draws people out, leading to moments where the narrator wonders if Kath herself felt loved or if her own deeper self remains unknown.
Sponsor Messages
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(00:17:08)
  • Key Takeaway: Sponsors promoted include ZipRecruiter for hiring, Zelle for easy money transfers to support loved ones, and Peloton’s Cross Training Tread Plus for varied workouts.
  • Summary: ZipRecruiter is highlighted for making hiring fast, with 4 out of 5 employers finding a quality candidate within the first day. Zelle is praised for facilitating small, meaningful gestures of support, like sending money for a car ride home. Peloton’s new Tread Plus is noted for its swivel screen and personalized plans via Peloton IQ.
Origin of ‘You Without Me’
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(00:21:33)
  • Key Takeaway: The song ‘You Without Me’ originated from watching Abby interact with their daughter Eva at soccer practice, realizing Eva possessed a personality and capability independent of Abby’s influence.
  • Summary: The song was inspired by watching Abby coach Eva’s soccer team, where Eva displayed a vulnerable personality without Abby’s direct involvement. This moment felt like seeing a child come to life independently, similar to Geppetto seeing Pinocchio become real. The host relates this to seeing Tish pursue music, realizing she cannot reach them in that separate world.
Meaning of ‘War with Time’
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(00:27:24)
  • Key Takeaway: ‘War with Time’ stems from a formative experience watching sensationalized news coverage of a plane landing with faulty gear, teaching Brandi about the collective power of media and marking her transition into adulthood.
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile first flew at age 17, and a later flight involved watching live news coverage of a plane with landing gear issues. The media sensationalized the potential disaster, but the collective media sentiment later shifted to supportive messaging, teaching her about the damaging and healing power of the collective.
Message of the Song ‘Human’
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(00:31:44)
  • Key Takeaway: The song ‘Human’ encourages finding joy and softness amidst destruction, symbolized by the beautiful red ‘wildfire suns’ seen in the Pacific Northwest, because life is too short to be consumed only by struggle.
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile sent ‘Human’ to Glennon because they both feel the weight of the world’s pain. The song references the beautiful, bright red wildfire suns that appear through smoke, representing a byproduct of destruction that is beautiful enough to focus on. The core message is that people must find joy and remain soft during difficult times, as life is merely a blink of an eye.
Sponsor Messages Part Two
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(00:36:21)
  • Key Takeaway: Coop Sleep Goods offers adjustable pillows to optimize sleep alignment, Armra provides Colostrum as a bioactive superfood for cellular health, and Alma simplifies finding in-network, affordable mental health therapists.
  • Summary: Coop Sleep Goods allows users to customize pillow height and firmness, with 86% of users reporting better sleep. Armra’s Colostrum supports gut, immune, and overall vitality by fortifying the body at the cellular level. Alma helps users find licensed, in-network therapists, often reducing therapy costs by an average of 80%.
Concept of ‘The Long Goodbye’
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(00:41:01)
  • Key Takeaway: The song ‘The Long Goodbye’ reflects on the chaotic first half of life being necessary for the peace found in the second half, and that the ache of separation implies that ultimate unity (’the first real hello’) is the true destination.
  • Summary: The song is a memoir about valuing the peace of later life over the chaos of youth, recognizing that the difficult middle years would have ruined the current relationship. The host believes the ache of separation inherent in life’s ’long goodbye’ suggests that the ultimate truth is unity, where the cup becomes the ocean.
Aging and Body Image Insights
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(00:44:33)
  • Key Takeaway: Two profound sentiments from Andrea—wanting to get old and only wanting ’to have a body’—offer a powerful antidote to viewing aging or body image as problems.
  • Summary: The host shares that Andrea’s desire to simply get old is a gift for anyone worried about aging. Furthermore, Andrea’s statement, ‘I don’t care what my body looks like. I just want to have a body,’ provides a crucial perspective on body image.
Discomfort with ‘Anniversary’ Song
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(00:46:54)
  • Key Takeaway: Brandi Carlile felt deeply self-conscious and uncomfortable including the stream-of-consciousness song ‘Anniversary’ on the album, almost leaving it off until the final master approval.
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile has no favorite song because they are all too important, but ‘Anniversary’ made her skin crawl due to its stream-of-consciousness nature. She felt uneasy revealing that level of internal thinking, fighting the urge to remove it until the last moment of production.
Existential Crisis and Separation
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(00:48:33)
  • Key Takeaway: The album’s songs repeatedly address the terrifying realization of internal separation, echoing a childhood existential crisis where one feels ‘all alone in here’ and separate from others.
  • Summary: The host connects the album’s themes to Tish’s childhood existential crisis upon realizing she was ‘all alone in here’ and separate from her mother. Songs like ‘Woman Overseas’ and ‘Joni’ explore whether we truly know each other, suggesting that returning to the self reveals this fundamental jail of separation.
Self-Focus vs. Connection
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(00:52:04)
  • Key Takeaway: The cultural emphasis on the inward journey of self-pursuit can become a dead-end road that only serves the ego, whereas sacrificing the self through connection frees us from identity.
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile critiques the modern emphasis on self-service as potentially leading to bowing to the ‘great and mighty me.’ She argues that while self-reflection is necessary, it must be circular, leading back out into the world, as the pull toward others and sacrificing the ego is what truly frees the soul.
Gravel Road Sound Symbolism
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(00:55:18)
  • Key Takeaway: The sound of car wheels on a gravel road symbolizes opposite concepts for Brandi Carlile (arrival and community) and Glennon (performance anxiety and obligation).
  • Summary: For Brandi Carlile, the sound means ‘somebody’s coming’ to be with her, representing connection and shared experience. For Glennon, raised by a football coach, the sound triggered an immediate need to ’look busy’ and activate her performance self, highlighting divergent childhood responses to external presence.
Album Uniqueness and Future
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(01:03:33)
  • Key Takeaway: Brandi Carlile confirms that Returning to Myself is a singular, intensely self-revealing work that will likely not be repeated, urging listeners to pay close attention.
  • Summary: Brandi Carlile stated that this album will likely be the only one composed almost entirely of self-revealing songs, as her usual style involves balancing them within a family band context. She confirmed she will not be ‘getting in that barn’ again, emphasizing the unique nature of this creative period.
Honesty in Relationships
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(01:04:45)
  • Key Takeaway: Brandi Carlile shared the vulnerable songs with Kath, who respected her artistry by not demanding discussion, offering a permission slip for human imperfection in relationships, especially within the lesbian community.
  • Summary: Kath responded to the most sensitive songs by affirming they were two of Brandi’s best, respecting her as an artist rather than demanding conversation about the content concerning their marriage. This honesty provides a gift of permission for slight human imperfection in relationships, countering the pressure for lesbian couples to appear ‘perfect.’
Mutual Artistic Respect
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(01:05:30)
  • Key Takeaway: The speaker recognizes their own enamored feeling toward Kath reflected in the songs.
  • Summary: Mutual respect exists between the artist and the subject, Kath. Listening back, the speaker hears how enamored they were with Kath while writing the songs. This feeling is simply about being enamored, regardless of how it might be perceived externally.
Permission for Imperfection
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(01:05:51)
  • Key Takeaway: The song provides a necessary permission for human fallibility within relationships, counteracting community pressure for perfection.
  • Summary: The song is viewed as a gift to the lesbian community, which often feels compelled to maintain ‘perfect’ marriages as tokenism. The music grants permission to be ‘just a smidge human in relationship.’ The hope is that listeners recognize this relatability across all relationships, allowing them to be valued equally.
Subject’s Enduring Coolness
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(01:06:43)
  • Key Takeaway: Authentic truth-telling in art enhances the subject’s inherent ‘witchy’ and cool energy.
  • Summary: If an artist tells the truth about someone, even if personal, that person seems cooler after the song concludes. Kath, specifically, maintains a ‘witchy energy’ that reinforces her coolness. The subject is described as ‘as cool as they get.’
Concluding Remarks and Sign-off
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(01:07:15)
  • Key Takeaway: The episode concludes with technical checks and a final philosophical directive to return to oneself.
  • Summary: A brief technical check confirms the mic status before the hosts declare the session over. The final instruction given to the audience is to ‘return to yourselves,’ emphasizing that this is the only viable path.
Podcast Production Credits
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(01:07:36)
  • Key Takeaway: We Can Do Hard Things is an independent production by Treat Media, which focuses on creating art for humans who want to stay human.
  • Summary: The podcast is an independent production brought to you by Treat Media. Treat Media’s mission is to make art specifically for humans who wish to remain human. Follow-up information directs listeners to the show’s social media handles on Instagram and TikTok.